Worship in Washington

[RJNorton]

One story I like from this time period goes as follows:

After Willie died in 1862 Dr. Francis Vinton, rector of Trinity Church, came down to Washington from New York. He was a friend of the Lincoln family, and was allowed in to see the President. Not wanting to beat around the bush, he told him it was not right to mourn like this over his son. He said, “Your son is alive in paradise with Christ, and you must not continue.” Lincoln sat there as though he were in a stupor, and then his mind caught onto the words that Dr. Vinton had said. He exclaimed, “Alive! Alive! Surely, sir, you mock me.” “No, Mr. President, it is a great doctrine of the church. Jesus himself said that God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.” Lincoln leaped to his feet and threw his arms around this pastor. He wept openly and sobbed, saying, “Alive! Alive! My boy is alive!” From that day on there began a change in Lincoln that even his wife Mary noticed.

One book that carries a version of this story is Twenty Days (p. 137). Twenty Days does not have footnotes, so I do not know the source. If anyone knows the story's source, please post! Thanks.

[Gene C]

(05-01-2021 04:13 AM)RJNorton Wrote:  One book that carries a version of this story is Twenty Days (p. 137). Twenty Days does not have footnotes, so I do not know the source. If anyone knows the story's source, please post! Thanks.

The earliest source I could fine is "The Inner Life of Abraham Lincoln: Six Months At the White House" by F B Carpenter (!866)
It can also found in "Abraham Lincoln: From Skeptic to Prophet", by Wayne Temple and "The Religion of Abraham Lincoln" or "The Almost Chosen People" by William J Wolf

[RJNorton]

Thanks, Gene. Apparently Carpenter was telling the story of the event as Lincoln told it to him. The Fehrenbachers give Carpenter's reminiscences a mixture of C's and D's.

[David Lockmiller]

(05-01-2021 04:13 AM)RJNorton Wrote:  One story I like from this time period goes as follows:

After Willie died in 1862 Dr. Francis Vinton, rector of Trinity Church, came down to Washington from New York. He was a friend of the Lincoln family, and was allowed in to see the President. Not wanting to beat around the bush, he told him it was not right to mourn like this over his son. He said, “Your son is alive in paradise with Christ, and you must not continue.” Lincoln sat there as though he were in a stupor, and then his mind caught onto the words that Dr. Vinton had said. He exclaimed, “Alive! Alive! Surely, sir, you mock me.” “No, Mr. President, it is a great doctrine of the church. Jesus himself said that God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.” Lincoln leaped to his feet and threw his arms around this pastor. He wept openly and sobbed, saying, “Alive! Alive! My boy is alive!” From that day on there began a change in Lincoln that even his wife Mary noticed.

As Gene states in his post, “[t]he earliest source I could find is ‘The Inner Life of Abraham Lincoln: Six Months At the White House’ by F B Carpenter (!866).” Roger, a much fuller and informative version of this story is published in the Carpenter book at pages 116-119. I quote at length therefrom for those who may not have access to this work.

William Wallace Lincoln, I never knew. He died Thursday, February 20th, 1862. He had just entered upon his twelfth year, and has been described to me as of an unusually serious and thoughtful disposition. His death was the most crushing affliction Mr. Lincoln had ever been called upon to pass through.

After the funeral, the President resumed his official duties, but mechanically, and with a terrible weight at his heart. The following Thursday he gave way to his feeling, and shut himself from all society. The second Thursday it was the same; he would see no one, and seemed a prey to the deepest melancholy. About this time the Rev. Francis Vinton, of Trinity Church, New York, had occasion to spend a few days in Washington. An acquaintance of Mrs. Lincoln and of her sister, Mrs. Edwards, of Springfield, he was requested by them to come up and see the President. The setting apart of Thursday for the indulgence of his grief had gone on for several weeks, and Mrs. Lincoln began to be seriously alarmed for the health of her husband, of which fact Dr. Vinton was apprised. Mr. Lincoln received him in the parlor, and an opportunity was soon embraced by the clergyman to chide him for showing so rebellious a disposition to the decrees of Providence. He told him plainly that the indulgence of such feelings, though natural, was sinful. It was unworthy one who believed in the Christion religion. He had duties to the living, greater than those of any other man, as the chosen father, and leader of the people, and he was unfitting himself for his responsibilities by thus giving way to his grief. . . . God has called your son into his upper kingdom – a kingdom and an existence as real, more real, than your own. . . . It is part of the Lord’s plan for the ultimate happiness of you and yours. Doubt it not.

“I have sermon,” continued Dr. Vinton, “upon this subject, which I think might interest you.” Mr. Lincoln begged him to send it at an early day – thanking him repeatedly for his cheering and hopeful words. The sermon was sent, and read over and over by the President, who caused a copy to be made for his own private use before it was returned. Through a member of the family, I have been informed that Mr. Lincoln’s views in relation to spiritual things seemed changed from that hour. Certain it is, that thenceforth he ceased the observance of the day of the week upon which his son died, and gradually resumed his accustomed cheerfulness.

[RJNorton]

I agree Carpenter is a valuable resource, and I really like his book. I find it amazing he could apparently remember all these details and stories.

[Steve]

I came across this excellent article from 2018 about Rev. Gurley, Lincoln, and faith:

https://quod.lib.umich.edu/j/jala/262986...w=fulltext

Gene, I would definitely recommend this article you - if you haven't read it already.

[Gene C]

Thank you Steve.
I haven't previously read it.

[David Lockmiller]

(05-11-2021 02:16 AM)Steve Wrote:  I came across this excellent article from 2018 about Rev. Gurley, Lincoln, and faith:

https://quod.lib.umich.edu/j/jala/262986...w=fulltext

Gene, I would definitely recommend this article you - if you haven't read it already.

Dr. and Mrs. Gurley attended the Lincolns’ Grand Presidential Party on February 5, 1862, held as both Willie and Tad Lincoln were ill with typhoid fever. Gurley would attend their sickbeds that month as the disease ran its course. While Tad recovered, newspapers announced on February 17 that there was no hope for Willie. The pastor reported that “as Willie Lincoln lay dying, he said to me, ‘Doctor Gurley, I have six one dollar gold pieces in my bank over there on the mantel. Please send them to the missionaries for me.” Willie participated in the Youth’s Missionary Society at Gurley’s church, which sponsored clergy in China. The contribution was duly noted in the church accounts book. Willie Lincoln died on February 20.

[Dennis Urban]

The 2018 article on the relationship between the Rev. Dr. Gurley and Lincoln is most comprehensive and fascinating. I had no idea that their relationship was so close and so introspective. Both men were able to distill complex thought processes into understandable words, even if they were for one's own use as the "Meditation on the Divine Will" certainly was. It is curious, however, that since a component of all religious ministers is evangelization, that Dr. Gurley seemingly never discussed baptism into the church with Lincoln. That would be a logical conclusion to some of their discussions. If my old memory serves me correctly, it is unknown if Lincoln was ever baptised into a formal denomination but the consensus is likely likely that he was not. Not withstanding that, Lincoln possessed an immense faith which influenced his convictions

[RJNorton]

(05-11-2021 01:23 PM)Dennis Urban Wrote:  If my old memory serves me correctly, it is unknown if Lincoln was ever baptised into a formal denomination but the consensus is likely that he was not.

Ed Steers discussed the possibility Lincoln was baptized in an article titled "A Question of Faith: Was Lincoln a Christian?" in the September 1999 edition of "North and South" magazine (Volume 2, Number 7). Here is a brief summary of what Ed wrote.

There are four stories that have circulated over the years concerning Lincoln's alleged baptism. The first one appeared in 1942. In this story a minister of the Disciples of Christ (Brethren) whose name was John O'Kane told of secretly baptizing Lincoln in a creek near Springfield. This account appeared in the "Christian Evangelist" in 1942. The second account appeared in a small book written by Reverend Freeman Ankrum and was published in 1947. In this account Lincoln was baptized by a member of the German Baptist Church commonly known as the "Drunkards." In the third account, which appeared in a book in 1956, a minister, who was a member of the Church of Brethren, came to Springfield from Indiana at night and the baptism was secretly carried out in the Sangamon River. The fourth and final account appeared in Mariah Vance's "Lincoln's Unknown Private Life." Vance was the Lincolns' housekeeper. The account is similar to the 3rd story only the baptism was allegedly carried out by the Reverend David Elkins. Since Elkins died in 1857 we know this account is false, and historians generally discount all of these stories.

Ed concluded, "The baptism of Abraham Lincoln is one of those apocryphal stories that persists in Lincoln lore. It never happened."

[Steve]

How do we know Abraham Lincoln wasn't baptized at his father, Thomas's church? I know Thomas was a Baptist and didn't practice infant baptism, but Abraham stayed with his father until he was 21. Wouldn't that be the most obvious possibility?

Is there some account or document which specifically says that he wasn't baptized before he left his father's household? It would seem to be a more likely possibility than some "secret baptism" story.