Lincoln and religion

[Steve]

(07-30-2017 04:55 AM)RJNorton Wrote:  Gene, I feel he did change. I think his faith grew during his time as President. I think this is seen in the Second Inaugural. I am surprised also that Nicolay said this. If Nicolay did not talk to the President about the topic then how would he know if his beliefs changed or not? Actually, I think Lincoln was changing by 1862 as evidenced by his Meditation on the Divine Will.
Maybe Nicolay was just saying what he thought Herndon wanted to hear?

If Nicolay never really talked to Lincoln about religion, maybe he never noticed a subtle shift in his writings and speeches. It's not as if Lincoln didn't mention religion at all before he took office. It's one thing to read his writings today to try to see how his thoughts on religion evolved but it would've been quite a different perspective to have lived it day to day. Also, the letter to Herndon was just over a month after the assassination; Nicolay may not have had enough time to fully reflect on the issue besides his own experience.

[Eva Elisabeth]

"I do not know just what they were, never having heard him explain them in detail; but I am very sure he gave no outward indication of his mind having undergone any change while here."

If you don't know nor cannot estimate someone's thoughts at all, how do you know you can safely exclude any change???

And if you read correctly, Nicolay just said "he gave no outward indication". Translation IMO - "I didn't see/hear/know anything at any time. I cannot comment on what was nor what might have happened." "I am very sure" in the context of the sentence could as well mean "I assume (but what do I know...)".

To me this is just a most diplomatic statement that leaves every possibly open and involves the speaker the least. I think Nicolay simply didn't want to comment in any way on such touchy subject that easily could evoke "gossip" and further speculations of all kind.
   

[Eva Elisabeth]

(07-30-2017 01:13 PM)Steve Wrote:  

(07-30-2017 04:55 AM)RJNorton Wrote:  Gene, I feel he did change. I think his faith grew during his time as President. I think this is seen in the Second Inaugural. I am surprised also that Nicolay said this. If Nicolay did not talk to the President about the topic then how would he know if his beliefs changed or not? Actually, I think Lincoln was changing by 1862 as evidenced by his Meditation on the Divine Will.
Maybe Nicolay was just saying what he thought Herndon wanted to hear?

If Nicolay never really talked to Lincoln about religion, maybe he never noticed a subtle shift in his writings and speeches. It's not as if Lincoln didn't mention religion at all before he took office. It's one thing to read his writings today to try to see how his thoughts on religion evolved but it would've been quite a different perspective to have lived it day to day. Also, the letter to Herndon was just over a month after the assassination; Nicolay may not have had enough time to fully reflect on the issue besides his own experience.

Forgot - I agree with Roger and Steve. Also - maybe for Nicolay himself change of mind on religion was rather unimaginable, then it would have been difficult to take over others' perspective.