Evidently Not A Lincoln Fan

[L Verge]

Another Quora comment popped up on my email today. The question posed was "Who was the better President, Lincoln or Jefferson, and why?" One answer from a gentleman in California:

"Let’s see, one wrote the Declaration of Independence and was a Founding Father that imparted a unique philosophy of self government and freedom.

"The other led a war that killed a million Americans in support of Northern bankers and industrialists.

"You choose."

[LincolnMan]

Yes. That’s a line of thinking that I’m sure we are all familiar with.

[AussieMick]

My understanding is that ...
Jefferson wrote the Declaration before becoming President (and would have done so in consultation with others).
The Declaration , proud and concise and beautiful though it is, failed to address or even mention the issue of slavery. Sure it would have been difficult and messy ... it would certainly have taken courage to at least refer to it.
What Jefferson did as President ... well, I'm sure the Louisiana Purchase was beneficial.

As for Lincoln, I point out that (as President) he wrote (alone) the greatest speech known to mankind.
He had the courage and ability to face down enemies, internal and external.
He was responsible for giving freedom to 4 million people.
Because of him, the soul of the US was saved from eternal shame and damnation.

If the people of the USA want to choose Jefferson ahead of Lincoln, thats their choice.
(IMO) the people of the world would place Lincoln ahead of any individual regardless of nationality. To paraphrase Edwin Stanton, now he belongs to us as much as to the USA.

[RJNorton]

(08-03-2019 07:36 AM)AussieMick Wrote:  If the people of the USA want to choose Jefferson ahead of Lincoln, thats their choice.
(IMO) the people of the world would place Lincoln ahead of any individual regardless of nationality. To paraphrase Edwin Stanton, now he belongs to us as much as to the USA.

Years ago there was a large poll of Americans, and they were asked to rate the Presidents. Lincoln was by far the most admired with an approval rating of 97%. Michael, I do not remember where Jefferson finished in the poll, but he definitely trailed Lincoln.

[L Verge]

(08-03-2019 07:46 AM)RJNorton Wrote:  

(08-03-2019 07:36 AM)AussieMick Wrote:  If the people of the USA want to choose Jefferson ahead of Lincoln, thats their choice.
(IMO) the people of the world would place Lincoln ahead of any individual regardless of nationality. To paraphrase Edwin Stanton, now he belongs to us as much as to the USA.

Years ago there was a large poll of Americans, and they were asked to rate the Presidents. Lincoln was by far the most admired with an approval rating of 97%. Michael, I do not remember where Jefferson finished in the poll, but he definitely trailed Lincoln.

I have not seen any recent polls on Presidential "popularity," but I think there is a current trend to glorify one who ended his term three years ago...

Do you think that the "re-evaluations" of Mr. Lincoln by a variety of authors over the past thirty years may have brought about such comments as these -- especially in a society that searches for the negatives and, likewise, is not prone to doing any real reading and research on their own?

[Steve]

(08-02-2019 07:27 PM)L Verge Wrote:  Another Quora comment popped up on my email today. The question posed was "Who was the better President, Lincoln or Jefferson, and why?" One answer from a gentleman in California:

"Let’s see, one wrote the Declaration of Independence and was a Founding Father that imparted a unique philosophy of self government and freedom.

"The other led a war that killed a million Americans in support of Northern bankers and industrialists.

"You choose."

Ugh. Sigh...

[Eva Elisabeth]

(08-03-2019 07:36 AM)AussieMick Wrote:  My understanding is that ...
Jefferson wrote the Declaration before becoming President (and would have done so in consultation with others).
The Declaration , proud and concise and beautiful though it is, failed to address or even mention the issue of slavery. Sure it would have been difficult and messy ... it would certainly have taken courage to at least refer to it.
What Jefferson did as President ... well, I'm sure the Louisiana Purchase was beneficial.

As for Lincoln, I point out that (as President) he wrote (alone) the greatest speech known to mankind.
He had the courage and ability to face down enemies, internal and external.
He was responsible for giving freedom to 4 million people.
Because of him, the soul of the US was saved from eternal shame and damnation.

If the people of the USA want to choose Jefferson ahead of Lincoln, thats their choice.
(IMO) the people of the world would place Lincoln ahead of any individual regardless of nationality. To paraphrase Edwin Stanton, now he belongs to us as much as to the USA.

Well said.

[LincolnMan]

(08-03-2019 07:36 AM)AussieMick Wrote:  My understanding is that ...
Jefferson wrote the Declaration before becoming President (and would have done so in consultation with others).
The Declaration , proud and concise and beautiful though it is, failed to address or even mention the issue of slavery. Sure it would have been difficult and messy ... it would certainly have taken courage to at least refer to it.
What Jefferson did as President ... well, I'm sure the Louisiana Purchase was beneficial.

As for Lincoln, I point out that (as President) he wrote (alone) the greatest speech known to mankind.
He had the courage and ability to face down enemies, internal and external.
He was responsible for giving freedom to 4 million people.
Because of him, the soul of the US was saved from eternal shame and damnation.

If the people of the USA want to choose Jefferson ahead of Lincoln, thats their choice.
(IMO) the people of the world would place Lincoln ahead of any individual regardless of nationality. To paraphrase Edwin Stanton, now he belongs to us as much as to the USA.

Great analysis. Not to mention did not free his slaves and Lincoln had none.