Another Lincoln misquote #2

[Eva Elisabeth]

(Roger closed the original thread before I could make it to reply to David's post #1, so here it goes. Please notice this thread is to discuss Lincoln misquotations, NOT current political situation and statement issues. Thank you.)

Thanks, David - I absolutely dislike the abuse of quotes, especially to purposely alternating the meaning by shortening or taking of context. And we all know the consequences if done in powerful media - as Lincoln said about journalists (to Mrs. Wells): "That is to say, they 'lie', and then they 're-lie'." (see Carpenter: "Six Months...", p.156)

Even Ford's had (maybe still has) a Lincoln misquotation on display - and even for sale:
http://store.fords.org/a549/vices-and-vi...aster.html

This was said TO him when he remained firm practicing exactly the opposite. I'd guess quite some Ford's visitors, especially such prone to the matter, left this educational institution attributing to Abraham Lincoln's mouth and mindset that vices were a necessity. A DC restaurant abuses the "quote" the same way for merchandising, and I doubt all customers are aware. (If so, this would be fine with me, but I doubt.)

This is the quote in its context:
“Riding at one time in a stage with an old Kentuckian who was returning from Missouri, Lincoln excited the old gentleman’s surprise by refusing to accept either of tobacco or French brandy. When they separated that afternoon – the Kentuckian to take another stage bound for Louisville – he shook hands warmly with Lincoln, and said, good-humoredly: 'See here, stranger, you’re a clever but strange companion. I may never see you again, and I don’t want to offend you, but I want to say this: My experience has taught me that a man who has no vices has d – d few virtues. Good-day.'”
(Alexander K. McClure: "Lincoln’s Own Yarns and Stories", p. 17.)

I think it's not an honorable quote, so no one should be misquoted by these words.

[JJamiekinder]

Eva,
Thank you for welcoming me to the forum and yes I did in fact have a wonderful time at the conference. I also want to extend my gratitude for pointing out the inaccuracy of my attributing the vice/virtue quote to Lincoln. i must admit that I have long thought that to have come from the lips of Lincoln. What a surprise when I went to my very own copy of "Lincoln's Own Yarns and Stories" to check your reference and found that in fact the quote was not from him but to him and the source was under my nose this whole time! This is why correspondence on sites like these can be so beneficial to expanding one's own knowledge of their specific topic.
I agree that Ford's needs to check some of their content for accuracy. Downstairs in their hallway they have a timeline of Lincoln and Booth's movements the day of the assassination. They leave out Lincoln's trip to the war department on the morning of the 14th. Now I will give them a slight pass here because the source attributing his presence at the War Department that day was probably as you know, from David Homer Bates's "Lincoln In The Telegraph Office", and is controversial in some historical circles. This was the source that the famous scoundrel chemist/historian Otto Eisenschiml manipulated to present the misleading theory that Stanton was behind Lincoln's murder. I personally believe that Lincoln was actually there that day as it's well documented that Lincoln went to the War Department everyday to check on the news from the battlefield. I would imagine that the 14th would be no different. William P. Binzel wrote a nice piece concerning this topic for the July 2016 issue of the Surratt Courier. I think its another perfect example of looking at and understanding the validity of sources that seems to be so relevant and important in today's world. I tell my students ( HS History teacher) everyday, that History has no right or wrong answers, just opinions, perspectives and "facts" supported by solid and verified evidence to back it up.
Thanks so much for the correction and I look forward to further exchange of ideas and knowledge of the topic we all love!
James

[RJNorton]

James, welcome to the forum. That error is a common one, and kudos to Eva for catching it.

William Herndon also included it in Herndon's Life of Lincoln. He wrote:

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"He (Lincoln) set out from Ransdell's tavern in Springfield, early in the morning. The only other passenger in the stage for a good portion of the distance was a Kentuckian, on his way home from Missouri. The latter, painfully impressed no doubt with Lincoln's gravity and melancholy, undertook to relieve the general monotony of the ride by offering him a chew of tobacco.

With a plain "No, sir, thank you; I never chew," Lincoln declined, and a long period of silence followed.

Later in the day the stranger, pulling from his pocket a leather-covered case, offered Lincoln a cigar, which he also politely declined on the ground that he never smoked. Finally, as they neared the station where horses were to be changed, the Kentuckian, pouring out a cup of brandy from a flask which had lain concealed in his satchel, offered it to Lincoln with the remark, "Well, stranger, seeing you don't smoke or chew, perhaps you'll take a little of this French brandy. It's a prime article and a good appetizer besides."

His tall and uncommunicative companion declined this last and best evidence of Kentucky hospitality on the same ground as the tobacco.

When they separated that afternoon, the Kentuckian, transferring to another stage, bound for Louisville, shook Lincoln warmly by the hand. "See here, stranger," he said, good-humoredly, "you're a clever, but strange companion. I may never see you again, and I don't want to offend you, but I want to say this: my experience has taught me that a man who has no vices has d — d few virtues. Good-day."

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I think the confusion (that Lincoln was the creator of the quote) may arise because Lincoln apparently repeated the quote (or similar) on at least one occasion. An English journalist named Edward Dicey once reported that Lincoln told him this story in 1862:

"I recollect once being outside a stage in Illinois, and a man sitting by me offered me a cigar. I told him I had no vices. He said nothing, smoked for some time, and then grunted out, "It's my experience that folks who have no vices have plaguy few virtues."

The Fehrenbachers give Dicey's recollection a "C." People who do not read carefully might think it was Lincoln who originally said the quote, not the man he met on the stagecoach. I have seen this quote erroneously attributed to Lincoln in more than one book.

[Eva Elisabeth]

Thank you for such great reply, James, I am glad you didn't misunderstand my well-intended "info". (Yes, one good example!!)