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Steve · 01-11-2017, 12:44 AM

Is there any known early documentation of Abraham Lincoln's February 12, 1809 birth date or the birth date of his sister? Say, from either the extended Lincoln or Hanks famlilies? I'm aware of Lincoln giving his birthday at the start of his political career and the birth dates written in the Lincoln family bible (although those were written in Abraham Lincoln's own hand). Is there any documention that's earlier? The Lincolns were Baptists, so there wouldn't be any infant baptism records, and I doubt there would be any newspaper birth notices for that area of Kentucky at that time. I'm just wondering if there's any documention earlier than four decades after the fact.

Eva Elisabeth · 01-11-2017, 04:59 AM

Hi Steve. Please go here. To my understanding Herndon refers to the record which Lincoln wrote in the Thomas Lincoln family Bible in 1851:

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/l/lincoln/linc...w=fulltext

http://lincoln.lib.niu.edu/islandora/obj...ln%3A36730

There's an eyewitness as for "one cold mornin' in Feb'uary" - from "The Story of Young Abraham Lincoln" by Wayne Whipple:

"Cousin Dennis Hanks gives the following quaint description of 'Nancy's boy baby,' as reported by Mrs. Eleanor Atkinson in her little book on 'Lincoln's Boyhood.c

'Tom an' Nancy lived on a farm about two miles from us, when Abe was born. I ricollect Tom comin' over to our house one cold mornin' in Feb'uary an' sayin' kind o' slow, 'Nancy's got a boy baby.'

"Mother got flustered an' hurried up 'er work to go over to look after the little feller, but I didn't have nothin' to wait fur, so I cut an' run the hull two mile to see my new cousin.

"You bet I was tickled to death. Babies wasn't as common as blackberries in the woods o' Kaintucky. Mother come over an' washed him an' put a yaller flannel petticoat on him, an' cooked some dried berries with wild honey fur Nancy, an' slicked things up an' went home. An' that's all the nuss'n either of 'em got.

"I rolled up in a b'ar skin an' slep' by the fireplace that night, so's I could see the little feller when he cried an' Tom had to get up an' tend to him. Nancy let me hold him purty soon. Folks often ask me if Abe was a good lookin' baby. Well, now, he looked just like any other baby, at fust—like red cherry pulp squeezed dry. An' he didn't improve none as he growed older. Abe never was much fur looks. I ricollect how Tom joked about Abe's long legs when he was toddlin' round the cabin. He growed out o' his clothes faster'n Nancy could make 'em.

"But he was mighty good comp'ny, solemn as a papoose, but interested in everything. An' he always did have fits o' cuttin' up. I've seen him when he was a little feller, settin' on a stool, starin' at a visitor. All of a sudden he'd bu'st out laughin' fit to kill. If he told us what he was laughin' at, half the time we couldn't see no joke.

"Abe never give Nancy no trouble after he could walk excep' to keep him in clothes. Most o' the time he went bar'foot. Ever wear a wet buckskin glove? Them moccasins wasn't no putection ag'inst the wet. Birch bark with hickory bark soles, strapped on over yarn socks, beat buckskin all holler, fur snow. Abe'n me got purty handy contrivin' things that way. An' Abe was right out in the woods about as soon's he was weaned, fishin' in the creek, settin' traps fur rabbits an' muskrats, goin' on coon-hunts with Tom an' me an' the dogs, follerin' up bees to find bee-trees, an' drappin' corn fur his pappy. Mighty interestin' life fur a boy, but thar was a good many chances he wouldn't live to grow up.'"

RJNorton · 01-11-2017, 06:29 AM

(01-11-2017 04:59 AM)Eva Elisabeth Wrote: To my understanding Herndon refers to the record which Lincoln wrote in the Thomas Lincoln family Bible in 1851:

Steve, I agree with Eva. As far as I know there was no contemporary documentation from 1809 concerning the birth of a child to Thomas and Nancy Lincoln. I think it's clear that Thomas and Nancy were married and were living on the Sinking Spring Farm in 1809, but I've never seen an announcement in a newspaper, birth certificate, etc. for Abraham's arrival. Abraham wrote that he was born February 12, 1809, and that's all we really have, IMO.

I do not know of any legal or contemporary documentation for the date.

Good question, Steve. Maybe someone on the forum can add to what Eva and I have said.

L Verge · 01-11-2017, 01:12 PM

(01-11-2017 04:59 AM)Eva Elisabeth Wrote: Hi Steve. Please go here. To my understanding Herndon refers to the record which Lincoln wrote in the Thomas Lincoln family Bible in 1851:

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/l/lincoln/linc...w=fulltext

http://lincoln.lib.niu.edu/islandora/obj...ln%3A36730

There's an eyewitness as for "one cold mornin' in Feb'uary" - from "The Story of Young Abraham Lincoln" by Wayne Whipple:

"Cousin Dennis Hanks gives the following quaint description of 'Nancy's boy baby,' as reported by Mrs. Eleanor Atkinson in her little book on 'Lincoln's Boyhood.c

'Tom an' Nancy lived on a farm about two miles from us, when Abe was born. I ricollect Tom comin' over to our house one cold mornin' in Feb'uary an' sayin' kind o' slow, 'Nancy's got a boy baby.'

"Mother got flustered an' hurried up 'er work to go over to look after the little feller, but I didn't have nothin' to wait fur, so I cut an' run the hull two mile to see my new cousin.

"You bet I was tickled to death. Babies wasn't as common as blackberries in the woods o' Kaintucky. Mother come over an' washed him an' put a yaller flannel petticoat on him, an' cooked some dried berries with wild honey fur Nancy, an' slicked things up an' went home. An' that's all the nuss'n either of 'em got.

"I rolled up in a b'ar skin an' slep' by the fireplace that night, so's I could see the little feller when he cried an' Tom had to get up an' tend to him. Nancy let me hold him purty soon. Folks often ask me if Abe was a good lookin' baby. Well, now, he looked just like any other baby, at fust—like red cherry pulp squeezed dry. An' he didn't improve none as he growed older. Abe never was much fur looks. I ricollect how Tom joked about Abe's long legs when he was toddlin' round the cabin. He growed out o' his clothes faster'n Nancy could make 'em.

"But he was mighty good comp'ny, solemn as a papoose, but interested in everything. An' he always did have fits o' cuttin' up. I've seen him when he was a little feller, settin' on a stool, starin' at a visitor. All of a sudden he'd bu'st out laughin' fit to kill. If he told us what he was laughin' at, half the time we couldn't see no joke.

"Abe never give Nancy no trouble after he could walk excep' to keep him in clothes. Most o' the time he went bar'foot. Ever wear a wet buckskin glove? Them moccasins wasn't no putection ag'inst the wet. Birch bark with hickory bark soles, strapped on over yarn socks, beat buckskin all holler, fur snow. Abe'n me got purty handy contrivin' things that way. An' Abe was right out in the woods about as soon's he was weaned, fishin' in the creek, settin' traps fur rabbits an' muskrats, goin' on coon-hunts with Tom an' me an' the dogs, follerin' up bees to find bee-trees, an' drappin' corn fur his pappy. Mighty interestin' life fur a boy, but thar was a good many chances he wouldn't live to grow up.'"

What a wonderful description! This is my first time reading it, and I immediately thought that it should be more widely available to the reluctant history students in today's classrooms.

wpbinzel · 01-11-2017, 05:30 PM

(01-11-2017 04:59 AM)Eva Elisabeth Wrote: Hi Steve. Please go here. To my understanding Herndon refers to the record which Lincoln wrote in the Thomas Lincoln family Bible in 1851:

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/l/lincoln/linc...w=fulltext

http://lincoln.lib.niu.edu/islandora/obj...ln%3A36730

There's an eyewitness as for "one cold mornin' in Feb'uary" - from "The Story of Young Abraham Lincoln" by Wayne Whipple:

"Cousin Dennis Hanks gives the following quaint description of 'Nancy's boy baby,' as reported by Mrs. Eleanor Atkinson in her little book on 'Lincoln's Boyhood.c

'Tom an' Nancy lived on a farm about two miles from us, when Abe was born. I ricollect Tom comin' over to our house one cold mornin' in Feb'uary an' sayin' kind o' slow, 'Nancy's got a boy baby.'

"Mother got flustered an' hurried up 'er work to go over to look after the little feller, but I didn't have nothin' to wait fur, so I cut an' run the hull two mile to see my new cousin.

"You bet I was tickled to death. Babies wasn't as common as blackberries in the woods o' Kaintucky. Mother come over an' washed him an' put a yaller flannel petticoat on him, an' cooked some dried berries with wild honey fur Nancy, an' slicked things up an' went home. An' that's all the nuss'n either of 'em got.

"I rolled up in a b'ar skin an' slep' by the fireplace that night, so's I could see the little feller when he cried an' Tom had to get up an' tend to him. Nancy let me hold him purty soon. Folks often ask me if Abe was a good lookin' baby. Well, now, he looked just like any other baby, at fust—like red cherry pulp squeezed dry. An' he didn't improve none as he growed older. Abe never was much fur looks. I ricollect how Tom joked about Abe's long legs when he was toddlin' round the cabin. He growed out o' his clothes faster'n Nancy could make 'em.

"But he was mighty good comp'ny, solemn as a papoose, but interested in everything. An' he always did have fits o' cuttin' up. I've seen him when he was a little feller, settin' on a stool, starin' at a visitor. All of a sudden he'd bu'st out laughin' fit to kill. If he told us what he was laughin' at, half the time we couldn't see no joke.

"Abe never give Nancy no trouble after he could walk excep' to keep him in clothes. Most o' the time he went bar'foot. Ever wear a wet buckskin glove? Them moccasins wasn't no putection ag'inst the wet. Birch bark with hickory bark soles, strapped on over yarn socks, beat buckskin all holler, fur snow. Abe'n me got purty handy contrivin' things that way. An' Abe was right out in the woods about as soon's he was weaned, fishin' in the creek, settin' traps fur rabbits an' muskrats, goin' on coon-hunts with Tom an' me an' the dogs, follerin' up bees to find bee-trees, an' drappin' corn fur his pappy. Mighty interestin' life fur a boy, but thar was a good many chances he wouldn't live to grow up.'"

An excellent post, Eva. Well done!!!!

Steve · 01-12-2017, 03:45 AM

Thanks for the links and Hanks oral history, Eva. That it was Abraham Lincoln himself writing the entries in the Bible and not his parents. Along with the birth and death information of brother Thomas, who died as an infant, missing leads me to suspect that the information came from beyond his immediate family. Perhaps from his Hanks relatives.

Eva Elisabeth · 01-12-2017, 04:56 AM

Bill - thank you so much!
Laurie - I agree. It wasn't even easy to find online!

Eva Elisabeth · (This post was last modified: 01-12-2017 06:26 AM by Eva Elisabeth.)

(01-12-2017 03:45 AM)Steve Wrote: Thanks for the links and Hanks oral history, Eva. That it was Abraham Lincoln himself writing the entries in the Bible and not his parents.

Steve - would his illiterate parents have been capable to do? I guess Abraham Lincoln also needed to inherit the bible first - to get access.

Eva Elisabeth · 01-12-2017, 10:10 AM

PS: My question was not meant a rhetorical one, I'd appreciate your (everyone's) opinion! Thanks.

Gene C · 01-12-2017, 11:37 AM

One place to start would be comparing the handwriting in the Bible to other early examples we have of Lincoln's handwriting.
I don't know if it's possible to determine when the entries were made, or even if by the same hand. Do we only have Herndon's account that it was written in Lincoln's hand around 1851? Some entries could have been by another family member, his step mother, cousin, step-sisters, or even a neighbor.

It would be interesting to see the original or copy of the original Bible.
That should not diminish the accuracy of the records (which Herndon transcribed). Anyone know where the Bible is now?

RJNorton · 01-12-2017, 11:47 AM

Gene, I believe it's at the Lincoln Birthplace National Historic Site.

The family record in the Bible is here.

Eva Elisabeth · 01-12-2017, 12:01 PM

Thanks - just to clarify - I didn't doubt Abraham Lincoln was the one who wrote into the Bible - the question was why hadn't anyone else nor he beforehe, and who helped with the info?

Steve · 01-12-2017, 02:09 PM

This may be taking things too far, but this Nov. 1850 census record could possibly indicate that Lincoln did not know his own birth date until after his father's death, around when he created the record in the Bible he inherited:

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:M859-LW1

RJNorton · 01-12-2017, 04:14 PM

It's 4 years off on Mary Lincoln's birth year (1818).

Eva Elisabeth · (This post was last modified: 01-12-2017 04:18 PM by Eva Elisabeth.)

Very interesting. Wild guess - how was the census data collection done technically/practically? Would both, Mary and Abraham, have been asked separately, or did one "testify" for the entire family? In the latter case it must have been Mary since she cheated about her age, making herself four years younger (she was 32, not 28 in 1850). She did that repeatedly. Maybe she "juveniled" her husband, too (who was long absent when on the circuit and perhaps also when the census data was taken).