Thanks for the info!

I have very little sympathy for these people. Especially someone who would viciously attack a bed ridden man with a large knife, in front of his own daughter who pleaded with him to stop.
http://www.rochester.edu/news/show.php?id=3316

They were involved in a terrible crime that ruined many lives. They had time to think about what they were doing, and they all could have stopped it. Youth is not an excuse. While their death's may have been cruel and tragic, so was the result of their actions .

(11-08-2014, 12:55 PM)Gene C Wrote: I have very little sympathy for these people. Especially someone who would viciously attack a bed ridden man with a large knife, in front of his own daughter who pleaded with him to stop.
http://www.rochester.edu/news/show.php?id=3316

They were involved in a terrible crime that ruined many lives. They had time to think about what they were doing, and they all could have stopped it. Youth is not an excuse. While their death's may have been cruel and tragic, so was the result of their actions .

Those were certainly terrible times. Men did a lot of unthinkable things. William Henry Seward was the face of abolitionism in the government, and thought by JWB to be next in line behind Johnson to the Presidency. For desperate men who had given everything for their country and just lost it all and facing a very uncertain future, anything was possible. Passions were high, and hundred of thousand of lives were lost. The 21st Century man has a hard time understanding these brutal acts, until you examine life in the war torn middle east.

Do the times make the man or does the man make the times?

Quote:They were involved in a terrible crime that ruined many lives. They had time to think about what they were doing, and they all could have stopped it. Youth is not an excuse. While their death's may have been cruel and tragic, so was the result of their actions .

Quote:Those were certainly terrible times. Men did a lot of unthinkable things. William Henry Seward was the face of abolitionism in the government, and thought by JWB to be next in line behind Johnson to the Presidency. For desperate men who had given everything for their country and just lost it all and facing a very uncertain future, anything was possible. Passions were high, and hundred of thousand of lives were lost. The 21st Century man has a hard time understanding these brutal acts, until you examine life in the war torn middle east.

While I agree and disagree with Gene; yes the actions were terrible abd horrendous - I still think that youth had a great deal to do with it -- boys do not think like men and do not consider consequences.

Thanks, Jim for phrasing it better than I could....

(11-08-2014, 04:54 PM)BettyO Wrote:

Quote:They were involved in a terrible crime that ruined many lives. They had time to think about what they were doing, and they all could have stopped it. Youth is not an excuse. While their death's may have been cruel and tragic, so was the result of their actions .

Quote:Those were certainly terrible times. Men did a lot of unthinkable things. William Henry Seward was the face of abolitionism in the government, and thought by JWB to be next in line behind Johnson to the Presidency. For desperate men who had given everything for their country and just lost it all and facing a very uncertain future, anything was possible. Passions were high, and hundred of thousand of lives were lost. The 21st Century man has a hard time understanding these brutal acts, until you examine life in the war torn middle east.

While I agree and disagree with Gene; yes the actions were terrible abd horrendous - I still think that youth had a great deal to do with it -- boys do not think like men and do not consider consequences.

Thanks, Jim for phrasing it better than I could....

Your Welcome. All I can say is that I'm fortunate that I've never had to experience anything like what either the victims or the perpetrators experienced.

Youth-has a lot to do with ones actions!

At least they were fighting for what they perceived as a cause - unlike the violent individuals that haunt our worlds today and kill just to kill. And then you have ISIS... They are fighting for a cause that dates back centuries. Ask the Crusaders about that cause.

I have often wondered as we have debated this issue before: What is the feeling about Seal Team Six taking out Osama Bin Laden? He was hit with a surprise attack, and we had also heard reports for years that he was a dying man due to kidney failure, etc. Does that put the special ops force of today in the same category as Lewis Powell?

I agree wholeheartedly with Jim; I don't ever want to be put in either side's shoes. Sherman said War is Hell and no one has disagreed with him yet. But each side has a cause and the objective is to win.

P.S. I could also end with this question - Is Osama really dead? If so, did he die long before his convenient execution near election time? If not, is he the force behind ISIS? Where's the proof of anything? Have fun with this one...

I think Osama is a taxi driver in New York City[toung in cheek].

Nope! He manages an Exxon Service Station/Convenience Store down the road!

That makes sense.He might drive a limo for us someday.Any place any where!Or, sell us a time share.

(11-09-2014, 04:24 PM)L Verge Wrote: I have often wondered as we have debated this issue before: What is the feeling about Seal Team Six taking out Osama Bin Laden? He was hit with a surprise attack, and we had also heard reports for years that he was a dying man due to kidney failure, etc. Does that put the special ops force of today in the same category as Lewis Powell?

It depends upon how you define "the same category." Seal Team Six had a carefully planned mission with back up and support of the most powerful military organization in the world. Lewis Powell was taking orders from a fellow expecting secondary gain of acclaim, with questionable support from Richmond. I always considered Booth a very, very, very, very, very pale imitation "wannabe" of Mosby. At least Mosby had a sense of honor, humor, and a delicious taste for irony.

I agree,and I think that the"Moby Dick theory"is worth looking at.

Quote:I always considered Booth a very, very, very, very, very pale imitation "wannabe" of Mosby. At least Mosby had a sense of honor, humor, and a delicious taste for irony.

Quote:... I think that the"Moby ***** theory"is worth looking at.

I agree with you both, gentlemen! According to what General Bradley T. Johnston and General William H. Payne said post-war, "Mosby was involved in the kidnap venture to a certain extent - and sanctioned Powell's involvement as well as that of others -

Every time I ruminate on what I think might have been "unthinkable" crimes and injustices committed during the Civil War and previous periods in American history, all I need to do is turn on CNN or pick up the NY Daily News. And I get jolted out of my self righteousness FAST.

"[i]Woman beats 3 year old toddler to death with electrical cord"

"Man kidnaps, rapes 16 year old girl before dousing her with gasoline and setting her ablaze"

"Family of four in SD bludgeoned to death and buried in the desert over business deal gone bad".

And that's just a sample, guys. What would the veterans of the Civil War-on both sides-have thought of us, their "enlightened" descendants, I often wonder?