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jonathan · 07-11-2012, 09:01 AM

So it crossed my mind this morning that Herold had plenty of chances to just abandon Booth. What do you think might have happened to him if he had done that? It's easy to see how he could have escaped into the Deep South or Mexico and quietly lived out his life. I wonder how history (and assassination enthusiasts) would remember him if he had just taken off.

That also brings to mind the question of how the other "main" conspirators really felt about the plot to abduct/assassinate Lincoln. I wonder if they really cared that much, or if they were just under Booth's spell. Herold, Powell, and Atzerodt were all young men, at least relatively so in the case of Atzerodt. And as we know, young men can do some stupid things. I just can't help but wonder if those three were just kind of hanging around looking for something to do as things were starting to wind down for the Confederacy, and fell in with Booth, who had a much different agenda. I wonder if they cared in anywhere close to the same way Booth did.

BettyO · (This post was last modified: 07-11-2012 09:27 AM by BettyO.)

(07-11-2012 09:01 AM)jonathan Wrote: So it crossed my mind this morning that Herold had plenty of chances to just abandon Booth. What do you think might have happened to him if he had done that? It's easy to see how he could have escaped into the Deep South or Mexico and quietly lived out his life. I wonder how history (and assassination enthusiasts) would remember him if he had just taken off.

That also brings to mind the question of how the other "main" conspirators really felt about the plot to abduct/assassinate Lincoln. I wonder if they really cared that much, or if they were just under Booth's spell. Herold, Powell, and Atzerodt were all young men, at least relatively so in the case of Atzerodt. And as we know, young men can do some stupid things. I just can't help but wonder if those three were just kind of hanging around looking for something to do as things were starting to wind down for the Confederacy, and fell in with Booth, who had a much different agenda. I wonder if they cared in anywhere close to the same way Booth did.

Great question, Jonathan!

Yes, Herold DID have a lot of time in which he could have simply abandoned JWB and went on his own. He could have gone further down South at any venture during the escape route and simply made himself pretty obscure. Herold was no dummy. Immature, maybe - but no dummy. He must have known that the gig was up for the Confederacy - but did he really CARE that much for the Confederacy? He never fought for it as Powell and Arnold did - never was in any armed services. However as the only boy in a family of women, he would have been seen more or less as their natural "protector and provider", thus no one thought less of him for NOT fighting!

Loyalty? I would have to say that yes, Herold was loyal to a friend, if nothing else. Did he think that perhaps a large payment from the Confederate government was in store? Had Booth told him such? Was that the reason for hanging on to JWB? We'll never know, unfortunately.

As for Powell, yes he was extremely young. Most of them were and yes, (although I got shot down for this once! HA!) young men can and DO some pretty stupid things - thinking that they are "mature" and that it makes them look big! Powell was a soldier and a good one. He was, although 2 years younger than Herold, probably a bit more mature and dignified inasmuch as he had been through a lot more in the army. However there are some instances in his army record where he was still pretty much of a prank loving boy who did some pretty immature and silly things while serving in the ranks. Boys will be boys!

Powell did say that he was working in the Confederate service and that he was assigned to the Secret Service branch. He claimed that he was following orders from highly placed superiors within the Confederate hierarchy. Who these "superiors" are, we will probably never know although I have always felt that Judah P. Benjamin was somewhat behind the kidnap plot.
I think that young Powell was sincere in following his orders and continuing his "fight for the Confederacy" or so he thought.... Again, in my mind, this is a stoke of immaturity. An older man would have considered that the war was over, so what was to be gained? Powell told Gillette that he expected a "promotion and the lasting gratitude of the Southern people." Again, to me, this sounds like something an immature boy would believe - not a mature man.

Powell made these statements to Reverend Dr. Gillette the night before he died. I don't think he'd lie, staring death in the face. A Baptist preacher's son, he wanted to get "Right with God"....

Lindsey · 07-11-2012, 10:03 AM

Well, Herold's legacy at least is not a pretty one. In historic fiction and in scholarly work he gets the same old bad rep from "idiot boy" to nothing short of mentally retarded. That is why I am writing his biography to finally set the record straight! In my opinion anyway...

While most people condemn them all for what they did, or didn't do in most cases, I think Davey's loyalty, although horribly misplaced, is an admirable trait. I always tell people on tour that we were all in our 20's once and did something, sometimes incredibly, stupid. Yes, he could have abandoned him, but I don't think he'd really know what to do w/o Booth.

He didn't really care about the Confederacy, not like Powell, Sam, and Mike as Betty has stated. In a lot of the testimony and reports he was considered Southern in his opinions but as one report stated, and I'm paraphrasing, he wasn't willing to shed a drop of blood for her. Can you blame him? I'm not sure he had much of a personal stake in it, as he obviously didn't feel strongly enough to enlist, and as far as I can tell they didn't really own slaves. Also, even though DC was pretty southern, it wasn't under attack like Powell's Florida. Most Confederates if nothing else wanted those dang Yanks out of their beloved homeland and that just wasn't the case for Davey.

jonathan · 07-11-2012, 10:19 AM

I agree that Herold's loyalty has to be considered when remembering him. The entire plot was just a stupid and incredibly reckless thing to take part in, but there are so many things to consider when judging. Once he and Booth had cleared the city, Herold could have taken off and I think maybe gotten away for good. The fact that he stuck by Booth at least says something good about him. Now, the question of exactly why he was loyal to Booth and stuck by him is wide open I guess.

RJNorton · 07-11-2012, 12:50 PM

Lindsey, that's great about your book. I will be first in line to purchase it!

BettyO · 07-11-2012, 02:01 PM

(07-11-2012 12:50 PM)RJNorton Wrote: Lindsey, that's great about your book. I will be first in line to purchase it!

I'll be the second! We need a decent biography on both Herold and Atzerodt (Dan, are you listening?!)

I KNOW Lindsey can do this and do it well. Just be forewarned - there is still new stuff to be discovered AFTER you publish - it never ends, and that is the beauty of it!

Lindsey · (This post was last modified: 07-11-2012 02:16 PM by Lindsey.)

Well, as Betty knows I've been working on a historic fiction book on Davey as well and once grad school is done I can really get cranking. I hope to be done with the fiction soon, if classes don't get in the way.

Also Betty--if we ever ran out of things to learn there'd be no fun left!