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New Eyewitness Account?
02-18-2025, 02:56 PM
Post: #164
RE: New Eyewitness Account?
(05-20-2021 04:12 AM)RJNorton Wrote:  Many thanks to Steve for sending these. Steve writes, The article's from page 1 of the April 4, 1909 edition of the Washington Post with an interview of Bedee's sister, Clara Apollonio, where she responds to an interview given by William Flood claiming he was the first person to climb into the box. The article has previously been posted to the Forum here:

https://rogerjnorton.com/LincolnDiscussi...l#pid80421

Though, she mistakenly thought it ran in the Post rather than the New York Times.

I'm also including images from one of the appendix of Reck's book where he discusses Bedee to be posted to the Forum if they can be. I've cropped out the parts of pages unrelated to Bedee and the papers which were in Lincoln's pockets at the theater.

[Image: bedee700.jpg]

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[Image: bedee703.jpg]

I checked Reck's book, and he maintains Flood, not Bedee, was the first to arrive in the box from the stage below.

Many thanks to Steve for sending this information.

Steve writes:

"I have something to post to the Forum. It solves a very minor question about the Lincoln assassination: How/when were the papers which fell out of Lincoln's coat after he was shot at Ford's Theatre were returned?

There've been two different versions of how the papers which fell out of Lincoln's coat were returned by Capt. Edwin E. Bedee of the 12th New Hampshire Infantry. Exactly how Bedee got ahold of the papers or was entrusted with the papers at the theatre is not exactly known, but he seems to have accompanied the group carrying Lincoln's body to Petersen House. What happens afterwards is where two accounts differ. The first is from Bedee himself told to his unit's historian sometime during the 1890's. The second is from Lt. Alexander Mcl. Crawford (who Maj. Rathbone had instructed to guard the box door at the theater that night), writing to John Hay in January 1887 recounting how Hay had instructed him on April 17, 1865 to try and find the papers which hadn't reappeared yet. Anyone interested can read the section from Reck's book about this in this earlier post for a lot more details:

https://rogerjnorton.com/LincolnDiscussi...l#pid83560

But to sum it up, Beede claimed he gave the papers to Sec. of War Stanton at Petersen House on the night of the assassination. Crawford claimed the papers were returned on the morning of April 18, 1865 - being dropped off at the White House that morning after being summoned to a meeting with a New Hampshire congressman (after he started his search on the 17th for the New Hampshire captain, who neither he, Hay, or Stanton knew the name of) who told Crawford the papers would be dropped at the White House if there would be no reprisals against the captain. Crawford agrees to the deal. Crawford couldn't identify the congressman, but he gives enough details to identify him as New Hampshire congressman Gilman Marston:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilman_Marston

I was able to find proof the Capt. Bedee had returned to his unit sometime on April 17, 1865. He was a former POW who was rerturning to his unit after being exchanged. The 12th New Hampshire Infantry was at time located around Richmond Va. So there's no way he could have dropped the papers off at the White House on the morning of the 18th. Since the papers weren't with Bedee's stuff when he was arrested they had to be in Washington. If they couldn't have been dropped off at the White House then they would have to be in the War Department safe after being given to Stanton. It's understandable that Stanton might not remember being given the papers that night with everything going on. It's also understandable that Crawford would incorrectly believe, two decades later, that the papers were dropped off at the White House on the morning of the 18th if he had later been told they had been recovered.

But what I don't understand is what Marston was up to, though. It seems obvious that Bedee never contacted Congressman Marston, although that was an eminently logical guess by Crawford. Because it's utterly bizarre that the congressman would have Crawford brought to him and then make this deal for the papers' return -- not knowing if it could even be fulfilled or not. Also the order for Capt. Bedee's arrest was issued on the evening of April 18th, so there's a good chance that Hay believing the deal had been reneged when they weren't dropped off at the White House that morning would have relayed that information to Gen. Hardie. Hay or Gen. Hardie then somehow learned Bedee's name and that led to the arrest order.

[Image: Bedee150.jpg]

[Image: Bedee151.jpg]

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[Image: Bedee153.jpg]

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New Eyewitness Account? - wpbinzel - 04-24-2018, 06:14 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 04-24-2018, 06:23 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 04-24-2018, 06:55 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - John Fazio - 04-24-2018, 07:09 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - wpbinzel - 04-24-2018, 07:40 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 04-24-2018, 08:46 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - smbovard - 04-24-2018, 06:35 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 04-25-2018, 04:02 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - wpbinzel - 04-24-2018, 09:40 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - AussieMick - 04-25-2018, 07:26 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Gene C - 04-25-2018, 01:32 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 04-26-2018, 01:53 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - AussieMick - 04-26-2018, 05:28 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 04-26-2018, 11:08 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 04-26-2018, 12:20 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 04-26-2018, 12:35 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 04-26-2018, 01:31 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 04-26-2018, 06:11 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Finnigan - 04-29-2018, 07:48 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 04-30-2018, 03:47 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Finnigan - 05-09-2018, 04:24 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 04-27-2018, 03:53 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - AussieMick - 04-27-2018, 06:44 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 04-27-2018, 04:05 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 04-28-2018, 03:51 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-01-2018, 02:28 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-01-2018, 06:35 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-01-2018, 08:03 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Finnigan - 05-20-2018, 01:42 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-20-2018, 03:41 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-20-2018, 03:57 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-20-2018, 05:03 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-20-2018, 05:13 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-20-2018, 09:56 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-21-2018, 12:36 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-21-2018, 10:38 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-22-2018, 03:46 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-22-2018, 12:29 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - AussieMick - 05-23-2018, 06:25 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-23-2018, 12:46 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - AussieMick - 05-23-2018, 01:43 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 06-02-2018, 11:29 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 06-03-2018, 02:57 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-21-2018, 12:36 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-21-2018, 12:59 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-22-2018, 12:49 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-22-2018, 08:15 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-23-2018, 07:55 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - AussieMick - 05-23-2018, 11:04 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-24-2018, 04:30 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-24-2018, 11:41 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-25-2018, 01:21 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-25-2018, 04:09 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-26-2018, 04:55 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-26-2018, 01:01 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-27-2018, 04:36 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-27-2018, 04:39 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-27-2018, 01:55 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-27-2018, 02:12 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-27-2018, 06:36 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 05-27-2018, 06:43 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-28-2018, 04:24 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-28-2018, 11:21 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Finnigan - 05-29-2018, 09:21 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-29-2018, 11:15 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-29-2018, 04:05 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-30-2018, 03:59 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-30-2018, 05:54 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 05-29-2018, 11:30 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-03-2018, 01:06 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-03-2018, 02:30 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-03-2018, 05:56 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Ernesto - 06-03-2018, 07:00 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-05-2018, 04:19 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-05-2018, 04:29 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Tom Bogar - 06-05-2018, 07:35 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-05-2018, 01:11 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 06-05-2018, 03:02 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-05-2018, 03:10 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-05-2018, 05:12 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-05-2018, 06:22 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 06-07-2018, 12:35 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-07-2018, 01:50 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-06-2018, 04:19 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-06-2018, 04:39 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Gene C - 06-06-2018, 05:36 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-06-2018, 08:53 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-07-2018, 04:18 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Tom Bogar - 06-07-2018, 02:46 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 06-07-2018, 04:47 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-07-2018, 05:43 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-07-2018, 06:29 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - kerry - 06-08-2018, 06:23 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-25-2018, 04:40 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - John Fazio - 06-25-2018, 08:47 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-26-2018, 04:55 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - John Fazio - 06-26-2018, 02:39 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-26-2018, 03:08 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-26-2018, 04:19 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-26-2018, 03:44 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-26-2018, 04:06 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-26-2018, 05:37 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 06-26-2018, 07:00 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Anita - 06-27-2018, 06:31 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-28-2018, 04:10 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-28-2018, 11:57 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 06-28-2018, 05:41 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 06-28-2018, 07:20 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 06-28-2018, 08:29 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-29-2018, 04:12 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 06-29-2018, 04:35 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - AussieMick - 06-28-2018, 09:56 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 06-29-2018, 05:57 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 07-18-2018, 04:31 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 07-18-2018, 08:40 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 07-18-2018, 08:53 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - L Verge - 07-18-2018, 11:43 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - JMadonna - 07-18-2018, 11:13 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Rsmyth - 07-18-2018, 03:05 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 07-18-2018, 03:37 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 07-19-2018, 07:27 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 07-19-2018, 04:39 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 07-20-2018, 04:37 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 03-03-2020, 05:21 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - LincolnMan - 03-03-2020, 07:17 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-20-2021, 04:12 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 02-18-2025 02:56 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-22-2021, 02:58 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-26-2021, 04:28 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 10-12-2021, 04:48 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Gene C - 10-12-2021, 05:18 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 10-12-2021, 10:12 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-13-2022, 12:19 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 05-13-2022, 08:18 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-14-2022, 04:11 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Tom Bogar - 05-14-2022, 01:55 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 05-14-2022, 02:34 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 12-13-2024, 07:55 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 12-14-2024, 08:08 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 12-14-2024, 10:07 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 12-15-2024, 06:10 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Gene C - 12-15-2024, 09:09 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Dave Taylor - 12-15-2024, 01:46 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 12-15-2024, 08:50 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 12-16-2024, 05:08 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 12-16-2024, 07:50 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - RJNorton - 12-16-2024, 09:28 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 12-17-2024, 08:43 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Anita - 12-17-2024, 08:41 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - AussieMick - 12-17-2024, 09:53 PM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 12-18-2024, 06:18 AM
RE: New Eyewitness Account? - Steve - 02-19-2025, 02:55 AM

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