An "out-of-character" moment for Lincoln?

[LincolnMan]

The following story was gleaned from the book Lincoln Shot: A President's Life Remembered by Barry Denenberg concerning an episode in Lincoln's life about a "wife beating." I had made a post about it on my Lincoln blog some time ago. See what you think-does it sound like something lincoln would do? Or is it more of a tale?

A “wife beating?,” you say? Well, it was not exactly what you might have been thinking. It wasn’t the wife being “beat”- it was the wife beating her husband. Her husband, you see, was tied to the town square whipping post. It happened in early Springfield. She was using a limb and, apparently, gave her man a thrashing. He was a shoemaker by trade. He was also said to be an alcoholic who physically abused his wife on more than one occasion. He had been warned that if he ever beat her again-he would be whipped himself. So when the news came that he did it again, he was dragged to the courthouse, stripped of his shirt, and tied to the post out in back of the building. That could not have been pretty. There were several men involved in the ”capture” of the abuser. Then his wife was sent for. She was up to the task. As she began her whipping of her husband, the men in the party of the vengeful episode sat down and watched. Finally, when the “leader of the pack” felt that the husband had received enough punishment- he was released. The men helped him put his shirt back on and he walked away from the scene cursing and promising vengence himself. The “leader of the pack” of the “rowdies” that aided the battered wife? You know him. His name was ABRAHAM LINCOLN. As far as is known, the husband stopped his physical abuse of his wife. He also didn’t perform the vengence on the men he swore he’d do.

[RJNorton]

Honestly, I find this very disappointing. Even if the guy had it coming there had to be another way. I believe this is one of the stories James Matheny (best man at Lincoln's wedding) told to William Herndon. I think Matheny admitted to being part of the group who helped Lincoln drag the guy to the post. Bill, I'd have to say it's probably true unless we have reason to doubt Matheny's word.

[Gene C]

Frontier justice. I'm not disappointed. Sometimes our legal system is inconsistanct in administering justice. IMO, glad to see men in the community defending the helpless and trying to right a wrong. The punishement seemed to have the desired effect, wihtout any permanent physical injury.

[LincolnMan]

Roger, I believe you are correct as far as the source being Herndon. The story somewhat "took me aback" when I first heard it too. I still have mixed emotions about it. What do others think? Gene, my head agrees with you but my heart is struggling!

[Donna McCreary]

Frontier justice . . hmmm. . . a very risky form of punishment in my opinion. An alcoholic is unpredictible and often seeks revenge when disgraced in a public forum. To have the man's wife thrash in public would have been humiliating and may have caused the man to become more violent the next time he was in a drunken rage.
On one level, I am glad to hear that the cobbler was clobbered. On the other, I feel that the wife probably remained silent the next time she was abused.

Is the story true? I hope not.

[Gene C]

(10-20-2012 05:11 AM)LincolnMan Wrote:  He was also said to be an alcoholic who physically abused his wife on more than one occasion. He had been warned that if he ever beat her again-he would be whipped himself. So when the news came that he did it again....

What do you think should have been the proper coarse of action?
What do you think the action taken by Lincoln says about his character?

[RJNorton]

(10-20-2012 06:16 PM)Donna McCreary Wrote:  Is the story true? I hope not.

I found the story on p. 189 of Herndon's Life of Lincoln:

[LincolnMan]

Thanks Roger for finding that source. That kind of thing could not happen nowadays. If it did there be criminal charges and lawsuits-and all that stuff. Of course, he probably would have been jailed for spousal abuse in the first place-if she reported him. Yes, those times were different for sure.

[Donna McCreary]

I am not sure that the drunkard would have been arrest for spousal abuse. There is a story from Oregon about a women who made a living making and selling butter. Her husband left her and the children destitute when he decided to sell all of their furniture and disappear. The women and her children struggled, but with the help of friends in the community, were able to rebuild their lives. She was able to purchase new furniture on credit. Soon, the husband reappeared and took legal possession of everything and disappeared again. It was said he was a drunkard. The abandoned wife could no longer support her children and the family was scattered. She was left with all of the debt. Feeling she had no choice but to divorce the drunkard, she sought the help of an attorney. Once the divorce was filed, the community turned on her and lamented about how easy to was for divorces to be granted.

Roger, thanks for the source of the story. I know those kinds of things happened -- it is in my heart that I wish there was never a need for such actions. We all bring our personal experience to the forum. It has been my personal experience that a man filled with drink can and will react through violent measurers. If angered, the violence because worse, not less. At the age of 10, I witnessed a male drunkard in my family try to murder my grandmother. I can not bear to think what would have happened if my parents had not been there to stop him.

That is why I wish this story were not true. I wonder what happened to the wife the next time her husband had too much whiskey and not enough sanity.

[Craig Hipkins]

I too have mixed emotions about this story. I am glad to see that the drunk cobbler got what was coming to him, but the way it was brought about seemed a bit savage. From all that I have read about Lincoln this does seem out of character. Of course, anything is possible. Those were different times. It makes me wonder if Matheney was stretching the truth a bit.

Craig

[RJNorton]

Craig, I too have wondered if Matheney did some embellishing. As far as I know there are no other known accounts of this incident. Based on Matheney's timing for the beating, Lincoln was both an attorney and a member of the Illinois House of Representatives when this happened. I understand Gene when he says "frontier justice," but I still wonder if this really occurred in the exact manner Matheney described.

[Craig Hipkins]

(10-26-2012 04:21 AM)RJNorton Wrote:  Craig, I too have wondered if Matheney did some embellishing. As far as I know there are no other known accounts of this incident. Based on Matheney's timing for the beating, Lincoln was both an attorney and a member of the Illinois House of Representatives when this happened. I understand Gene when he says "frontier justice," but I still wonder if this really occurred in the exact manner Matheney described.

I agree Roger. If we are to go on Matheney's memory alone I would consider the whole incident suspect. It could be just another Lincoln legend.

Craig

[LincolnMan]

Forum members, help me out on this one: it seems to me (speaking of "an out of character moment for Lincoln") that there was a story of young Lincoln and a buddy sewing a racoon skin on a dog after a "coon hunt." I believe the dog was then killed by another animal- thinking the dog was a racoon. Anyone familiar with the stroy? Where is the account found?

[RJNorton]

Bill, I have read of sewing up hogs' eyes on one of the trips to New Orleans, but I don't remember the story you refer to.

[LincolnMan]

I remember it from somewhere. Anyone know about it?