Tribute

[brtmchl]

Don't let the words Glenn Beck sway you from reading this article. It was written by an 11th grader from Kilgore High School and the winner of our “Before They Were Famous” essay writing contest exploring the early life Abraham Lincoln.

It thought it was a sweet tribute and am happy to hear students being impacted by such a great historical figure.


http://www.glennbeck.com/2017/04/19/abra...GB-Control

[RJNorton]

Thank you for posting this, Mike. It reminded me of my grade school years growing up in Illinois. The teachers at Holmes School in Oak Park all emphasized Lincoln's pre-Presidential years. My third or fourth grade teacher loved to talk about Ann Rutledge. As I recall, I do not think I had a teacher who discussed/taught his Presidency until high school. Personally, I find the early years just as interesting, if not more so, than his Presidential years.

[Gene C]

Agree with you Roger.
I had been to Springfield, New Salem and his Boyhood Home in Indiana, but it was such a much greater experience to go with a group from the forum who just new so much and shared with everyone. I got so much more out of the 3 days together than when I had just gone on my own with the family. It wasn't just what I learned from Joe, Dave, Scott, Rob & Bill (and their wives), it was the desire after the trip to learn more. And we went places I never would have thought about going to see. That, and a great group of people to meet and become friends with. It is a wonderful time we would like to share with others.

Thanks for sharing the article Mike. Like you said, it is nice to see students being impacted by such a great historical figure.
He still impacts me.

[Thomas Kearney]

Thanks for sharing. Excellent t shirts Beck is selling, I think I might buy one. I just need to go to New Salem and maybe tag along on Gene's Springfield tour this fall.

[LincolnMan]

Great essay written by a young person! I like the shirt too. I don't know much about Mr. Beck but I thought he had expressed negative views if Lincoln; am I right?

[David Lockmiller]

(04-21-2017 10:01 AM)RJNorton Wrote:  My third or fourth grade teacher loved to talk about Ann Rutledge.

Roger, do you recall some of the things that she said about Lincoln and Ann Rutledge?

[RJNorton]

David, I recall she emphasized that Ann Rutledge was both beautiful and smart. She said Ann Rutledge was the most attractive girl in New Salem. She stressed that all the residents of New Salem thought very highly of her, and that she had a very positive effect on Lincoln. And then she told us how depressed Abraham Lincoln was when she died so young. The teacher was passionate about the romance, and I remember the sadness in her voice when she told us about Ann dying. This was over 60 years ago, so I do not recall all the details she taught us.

[Eva Elisabeth]

Yes - very nice essay by a young student!

[LincolnMan]

I don't remember even being taught anything about Lincoln in any of my public education. Wow.

[David Lockmiller]

(04-22-2017 04:04 PM)RJNorton Wrote:  David, I recall she emphasized that Ann Rutledge was both beautiful and smart. She said Ann Rutledge was the most attractive girl in New Salem. She stressed that all the residents of New Salem thought very highly of her, and that she had a very positive effect on Lincoln. And then she told us how depressed Abraham Lincoln was when she died so young. The teacher was passionate about the romance, and I remember the sadness in her voice when she told us about Ann dying. This was over 60 years ago, so I do not recall all the details she taught us.

Roger, thanks. I think that she was right in all of what she said. You were lucky to have her as your teacher.

I also believe that if Abraham Lincoln had married Ann Rutledge, there would have been no possibility that he would have been President of the United States.

[Gene C]

(04-23-2017 06:02 PM)David Lockmiller Wrote:  I also believe that if Abraham Lincoln had married Ann Rutledge, there would have been no possibility that he would have been President of the United States.

I can agree with that David. Despite what Herndon and others may have negatively said about Mary and their marriage, Mary was the one that helped him through the setbacks, and kept the ambition alive to keep trying. From the beginning she saw something about him that others didn't see.

[David Lockmiller]

(04-23-2017 08:18 PM)Gene C Wrote:  

(04-23-2017 06:02 PM)David Lockmiller Wrote:  I also believe that if Abraham Lincoln had married Ann Rutledge, there would have been no possibility that he would have been President of the United States.

I can agree with that David. Despite what Herndon and others may have negatively said about Mary and their marriage, Mary was the one that helped him through the setbacks, and kept the ambition alive to keep trying. From the beginning she saw something about him that others didn't see.

I have a slightly different take. I think that politics became the center of Lincoln's life after the death of Ann and then the marriage to Mary. If Abraham Lincoln had married Ann Rutledge, I believe that a happy marriage and family life together would have occupied much more of his time and attention. Politics would not have become the overwhelming center of Lincoln's life and, as a result, he would not have become President of the United States at this critical time in the history of this nation and the world.

Lincoln preserved both democracy for the world and the integrity of this nation at the same time by means of all of his efforts and accomplishments against the trials and tribulations of five long and difficult years of civil war. For the greater good of all mankind, I must hopefully say as Lincoln said in his second inaugural address regarding the immense suffering and loss by so many, endured on both sides of the Civil War: "the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether."

[RJNorton]

Gene and David, is it at all possible that a marriage to Ann Rutledge might not have deterred Lincoln, and his political and legal careers would have turned out essentially the same? I am not really in disagreement with what you gentlemen say; I am just suggesting the possibility, although my tendency is to agree with you.

Lincoln boarded with the Rutledges in 1832, and he certainly got to know her at that time. I cannot say when his feelings for her developed, but can we say by 1833? Anyway, this did not deter him from politics as on August 4th, 1834, Lincoln was elected to the Illinois General Assembly. It was almost four months before the General Assembly convened, and during these months Lincoln seriously took up the study of law. So his goal of becoming a politician and lawyer was not deterred by his feelings for Ann. She died in 1835, and in 1836 he again ran and was elected to the General Assembly. I believe I read somewhere that she was planning on going to school in Jacksonville so she could become the educated wife of a lawyer/politician. Is it at all possible she could have encouraged and supported him just as Mary did?

[Gene C]

Roger, I think it's possible.
I am also thinking of the interest Mary Todd shared on politics, and maybe even more important, her social connections through family in the Springfield area.
It perhaps gave Lincoln just a little more credibility as Mary was probably considered a good catch. He gained socially (and some financially) through his marriage.

[David Lockmiller]

(04-24-2017 02:23 PM)RJNorton Wrote:  Gene and David, is it at all possible that a marriage to Ann Rutledge might not have deterred Lincoln, and his political and legal careers would have turned out essentially the same? I am not really in disagreement with what you gentlemen say; I am just suggesting the possibility, although my tendency is to agree with you.

I believe I read somewhere that she was planning on going to school in Jacksonville so she could become the educated wife of a lawyer/politician. Is it at all possible she could have encouraged and supported him just as Mary did?

Lincoln himself wrote of his decision to reenter politics: “In 1854, his profession had almost superseded the thought of politics in his mind, when the repeal of the Missouri compromise aroused him as he had never been before.” (John Locke Scripps, a senior editor of the Chicago Press and Tribune, managed to convince Lincoln to write an autobiographical account that would serve as the basis for 1860 presidential campaign biography. See Basler’s “Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln,” 4:67)

I know that Lincoln said at the time in 1854 that he was contented with his work as a lawyer and his family life (but I could not immediately find a source reference for this statement in order to use his own words of expression).

Taking on Senator Douglas for his Senate seat in 1858 was an exhausting, almost Sisyphean task, but nonetheless Lincoln did so. Lincoln did so married to Mary. Would he have done so married to Ann? I do not know. Perhaps a very happy and contented family life with Ann and their children may have been a prohibitive factor for Lincoln. However, Gene also makes a very good argument in his posting about Mary's extreme interest in and connections to politics. [Even Stephen Douglas courted her.] Ann most certainly did not possess these combined political attributes.