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+--- Forum: Assassination (/forum-5.html)
+--- Thread: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... (/thread-296.html)
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - LincolnMan - 08-31-2012 09:12 PM
Rob: I think what he did was evil but I don't demonize him. Like I mentioned he was not the Devil and I don't think he was insane. That would be too easy to account for his actions. I really believe he did what he did because of his beliefs. Obviously, I don't agree with what he did-nor the way he did it.
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - L Verge - 09-01-2012 12:02 PM
Thank you, Bill, for taking the time to understand the complexities of John Wilkes Booth and the critical time in which he lived and the beliefs that he took with him to the grave. I have never condoned his actions either, but I am part of a large group who try to understand what drove him to commit his crime.
Again, I'm preaching that we need to judge people and their actions against the broad spectrum of what is happening in the world around them -- not as just one isolated deed.
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - LincolnMan - 09-01-2012 12:44 PM
Thank you Laurie-that is exactly I i seek to do!
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - J. Beckert - 09-01-2012 06:33 PM
It's funny how people can study this event for years and have vastly different opinions on the people involved.
We've been through this before Rob and I respect your opinion, but I'm still not buying the coward angle on Booth. Had he shot Lincoln in his carriage as he arrived at the theater and ran, I'd agree with you. He had no way of knowing what obstacles would be in his way between 10th. St. and Baptist Alley. Guards, armed soldiers, etc. He moved ahead anyway and I think he fully expected to be challenged. While shooting an unarmed man in the back of the head isn't especially brave, I believe to Booth it was a political hit to be accomplished anyway possible. His violent attack on Rathbone also shows he was no coward. This assassination story could have ended very differently if the element of surprise wasn't in Booth's favor and I think he was prepared to fight his way out of that theater in a very violent manner to assure his freedom. He tried to stab Withers and assaulted Peanut John, too. A coward runs away from danger. A person with courage moves toward the danger, oblivious to their own well being.
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - Gene C - 09-01-2012 07:21 PM
I leaning in Rob's direction on this one. Booth used people, he appears to be self centered. Almost everyone has some redeemalbe qualities, so I will assume Booth had some too. Nora Titone's book "My Thoughts Be Bloody" didn't have much good to say about him. For someone who was in touch with the Confederate Gov't, and traveled extensively in the north and the south, he sure misjudged the situation.
As far as his violent attack on Rathbone, well Rathbone stood in the way of his escape. That theater box was tiny. He had to get him out of the way somehow, and quickly. I don't think he was a coward, but he didn't have any problem taking some of the other conspirators down with him.
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - Jim Garrett - 09-01-2012 08:00 PM
I think the views on JWB will always run the spectrum. Most of us grew up on JWB was a crazed actor, a bloodthirsty murderer, a rouge assassin, etc. He was a one demensional charactor. In recent years, a vast amount of in-depth information has brought out much more information about the man, son, brother, Southern patriot. The one thing that we will never have is a full explanation of ":why" from the source.
This is the great thing about this forum. It really opens up communication and information.
I volunteer at Ford's and have done presentaions on the events of April '65 to thousands of visitors. From my experience, it appears that still, the majority of Americans still know next to nothing about the assassination. Most still think some crazy actor acted alone. It's really up to people like us to educate the masses to the most pivotal moment in American history.
Thank you
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - LincolnMan - 09-01-2012 08:12 PM
Right on Jim. I just posted another thread today about why we (people like us)-must keep Lincoln history alive-and, of course, not just that history but all of our history.
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - Rob Wick - 09-01-2012 08:29 PM
Joe,
You're right that we've danced this dance before, and I'm got far too much work to do to take another round on the floor, but I just want to ask one question. What does knowing Booth's political views do for us? It certainly cannot justify his actions (which I want to vigorously acknowledge that no one here has suggested), and it isn't a legal defense, so I guess I'm saying, yes, Booth may have seen it as a political act. So what?
Best
Rob
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - J. Beckert - 09-01-2012 09:25 PM
It is beating a dead horse, Rob. We've agreed to disagree on this before and I'm sure we can again, but here's my spin on the whole mess.
While I feel the assassination was a complete rogue operation, at some point Booth had some backing from Confederate higher ups - at least for his kidnap plan. His decision on April 14th., to shoot Lincoln had some political, although misguided, motives behind it. I believe he thought he was on a self appointed mission to do something that in his mind, could turn the tides. His motives are really a moot point. His actions, like I said earlier, don't show any cowardice in my mind.
I just can't see a coward walking into a crowded theater with over 1,000 patrons, some of whom were armed military men, in the Union Capital, not knowing how or if Lincoln was guarded and still be determined to push his plan forward. His actions toward Rathbone and the fact he actually stopped to address the crowd scream defiance to me. Like I said earlier, a coward would have shot Lincoln in his carriage and achieved the same objective.
As a former State Trooper, (Boy, did it feel good to type that! Today's my first day as a civilian!) I've been in situations with cowards and you can actually see the fear in their faces. Sometimes when you have to go forward with a task and you don't know what the outcome will be or if you're going to come out alive, some people will shy away. They're cowards. I've had to go into buildings looking for suicidal people who've said, if you send a Trooper in here, I'm killing him. One time that happened 3 guys elected to stay outside while another Trooper volunteered to go in with me. That's how I've formed my opinion that Booth was not a coward. He had no idea what was going to transpire after he fired his shot and he did it anyway. Was his act despicable? Yes, absolutely. Cowardly? Not in my opinion.
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - Rob Wick - 09-01-2012 09:44 PM
Quote:As a former State Trooper, (Boy, did it feel good to type that! Today's my first day as a civilian!)
Congratulations Joe. Thanks for doing a job that very few people would ever do.
Best
Rob
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - J. Beckert - 09-01-2012 09:54 PM
Thanks a lot, Rob. I appreciate that. So that means I'm right then. Yes?
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - Rob Wick - 09-01-2012 09:56 PM
Ummm. Let me get back to you on that one.
Best
Rob
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - J. Beckert - 09-01-2012 11:13 PM
Once again we have a truce. I respect your opinion. I just wanted to post mine.
That's what keeps this story alive. Different opinions and new ideas.
Thanks, Rob.
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - Jim Garrett - 09-02-2012 05:33 AM
(09-01-2012 09:25 PM)J. Beckert Wrote: It is beating a dead horse, Rob. We've agreed to disagree on this before and I'm sure we can again, but here's my spin on the whole mess.
While I feel the assassination was a complete rogue operation, at some point Booth had some backing from Confederate higher ups - at least for his kidnap plan. His decision on April 14th., to shoot Lincoln had some political, although misguided, motives behind it. I believe he thought he was on a self appointed mission to do something that in his mind, could turn the tides. His motives are really a moot point. His actions, like I said earlier, don't show any cowardice in my mind.
I just can't see a coward walking into a crowded theater with over 1,000 patrons, some of whom were armed military men, in the Union Capital, not knowing how or if Lincoln was guarded and still be determined to push his plan forward. His actions toward Rathbone and the fact he actually stopped to address the crowd scream defiance to me. Like I said earlier, a coward would have shot Lincoln in his carriage and achieved the same objective.
As a former State Trooper, (Boy, did it feel good to type that! Today's my first day as a civilian!) I've been in situations with cowards and you can actually see the fear in their faces. Sometimes when you have to go forward with a task and you don't know what the outcome will be or if you're going to come out alive, some people will shy away. They're cowards. I've had to go into buildings looking for suicidal people who've said, if you send a Trooper in here, I'm killing him. One time that happened 3 guys elected to stay outside while another Trooper volunteered to go in with me. That's how I've formed my opinion that Booth was not a coward. He had no idea what was going to transpire after he fired his shot and he did it anyway. Was his act despicable? Yes, absolutely. Cowardly? Not in my opinion.
Joe, Thank you for your service.
RE: Something about John Wilkes Booth you may not know... - LincolnMan - 09-02-2012 06:04 AM
Joe: Congrats!