My Own White Guilt

[brtmchl]

Slavery was a world wide epidemic! Not an American Institution.
Slavery has plagued every race and religion known to man. Whites, Blacks, Asians, Muslims, Christians, Jews.
Slavery in Africa has existed throughout the continent for many centuries. Debt slavery, enslavement of war captives, military slavery, and criminal slavery were all practiced in various parts of Africa and some believe still exists.
Slavery was part of this country long before it was a country and The Constitution was written. When Dutch trading ships started showing up in Africa, warring tribes started capturing and selling their neighbors rather than killing them. The first 19 or so Africans arrived ashore near Jamestown, Virginia, in 1619, brought by Dutch traders who had seized them from a captured Spanish slave ship. In 1692 French explorers Louis Joliet and Father Jacques Marquette discovered slavery among the Indians in Illinois. Indians captured women and children from other tribes to be used as slaves.
The first black slaves of record in Illinois were brought by Philipe Francois Renault in 1719
When the British settled, about 600,000 slaves were imported into the Thirteen Colonies constituting 5% of the twelve million slaves brought from Africa to the Americas. The great majority of African slaves were transported to sugar colonies in the Caribbean and to Brazil. Since people of African origins were not English subjects by birth, they were considered foreigners and generally outside English Common Law. During most of the British colonial period, slavery existed in all the colonies. People enslaved in the North typically worked as house servants, artisans, laborers and craftsmen. The South depended on an agricultural economy, slaves there worked primarily in agriculture. Many Scots-Irish, Irish and Germans came to this country in servitude to pay their way. Historians estimate that more than half of all white immigrants to the English colonies of North America during the 17th and 18th centuries came as indentured servants.
British rule allowed Slavery in The New World, in fact The Slavery Abolition Act wasn't written in Parliment until 1833. Slavery was officially abolished in most of the British Empire on in 1834. However, only slaves below the age of six were freed in the colonies. Former slaves over the age of six were redesignated as "apprentices", and their servitude was abolished in two stages; the first set of apprenticeships came to an end in 1838, while the final apprenticeships were scheduled to cease on in 1840.

Slavery in the United States was the legal institution that existed in the United States of America in the 17th to 19th centuries. Slavery had been practiced in British North America from early colonial days, and was recognized in the Thirteen Colonies at the time of the United States' Declaration of Independence in 1776.
The Constitution wasn't clear on the subject of slavery. On one hand it recognizes Slaves as only Property but later, thanks to the 3/5 rule it acknowledges Slaves as a partial person or depending how you look at it not equal to the whole of a person.
Section 9 of Article I forbade the Federal government from banning the "importation" of persons that state law considered "proper to admit"
Article V prohibited amending those portions of Section 9 before 1808. By prohibiting changes for two decades to regulation of the slave trade, Article V effectively protected the trade until 1808, giving the States 20 years to resolve this issue.
Delegates approved Section 2 of Article IV, which prohibited states from freeing slaves who fled to them from another state, and required the return of chattel property to owners.
In a section negotiated by James Madison of Virginia, Section 2 of Article I designated "other persons" to be added to the total of the state's free population, at the rate of three-fifths of their total number, to establish the state's official population for the purposes of apportionment of Congressional representation and federal taxation.

Most of the information above can easily be found on Wikipedia.

But, Thanks to Lincoln, Emancipation was passed ( which in my opinion was a test balloon for the 13th Amendment) as well as the 13th Amendment clearly abolishing slavery and involuntary servitude, except as punishment for a crime.
Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction. Section 2. Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation

My question is: why is there any question as to whether Lincoln only wanted to do this or only wanted to do that? Slavery is bad! Especially through the eyes of a 21 century person. Oh wait! Lincoln and his administration DID something about it. He abolished it! Clearly, redefining the Constitution without ambiguity. All the while preserving The Union. I'm tired of White guilt. I'm tired of acting as if America was the monster of the world with its institution of Slavery. No corner of the World is above guilt.

As for my own White guilt:
My 6th Great Grandfather Joseph Malcolm Sr. came to this country a Scotts - Irish immigrant as an indentured servant In the late 1700's.
After paying his debts he located in Pendleton Co, Virginia. I have a copy of a census report from 1820, at the age of 80, Among those counted in this census are his wife Dorothy Polly Lewis and 3 un named Slaves. No names just 1 female age 14- 25, 1 male age 14-25, and 1 male age 26-44. Number of persons engaged in Agriculture 3.

I also have a Great Grandma Mary Hutchinson of Wayne County WV who after her first husband died married Absalom P Booth in , haven't found any connections.

[L Verge]

Thank you for this, Mike. I feel no personal white guilt - even though some of my ancestors were slaveholders. I refuse to be judged by the actions of my ancestors over 150 years ago.

Whether others want to admit it or not, great strides have been made in this country in the field of civil rights over the past sixty years. Some have made good and productive use of those advancements while others have chosen to take advantage of the system. And on this level, I speak about people in all areas of society and of all races and creeds.

Personally, I will respect those who obtain an education, work towards the betterment of themselves and this country, and live an honorable life. For those who choose to do nothing except expect more handouts from the government, I have little or no respect. When they could be working and productive members of society, but choose to live off the hard working citizens, I feel that such people (again, no matter their background) are treating taxpayers as economic slaves of sorts.

I would like to believe that my opinions today are very similar to the opinions held by Lincoln and other leaders of his day. Freedom brings opportunity to help one's self.

[RJNorton]

(01-29-2014 07:12 PM)L Verge Wrote:  I would like to believe that my opinions today are very similar to the opinions held by Lincoln and other leaders of his day. Freedom brings opportunity to help one's self.

Laurie, I have a web page that contains some quotes from Abraham Lincoln on the subject of labor and work. It is here.

[L Verge]

I only know a few of his quotes, but this one I do know and believe in -- and wish that many of our citizens would strive towards also:

"Property is the fruit of labor...property is desirable...is a positive good in the world. That some should be rich shows that others may become rich, and hence is just encouragement to industry and enterprise. Let not him who is houseless pull down the house of another; but let him labor diligently and build one for himself, thus by example assuring that his own shall be safe from violence when built." The Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln edited by Roy P. Basler, Volume VII, "Reply to New York Workingmen's Democratic Republican Association" (March 21, 1864), pp. 259-260.

[LincolnMan]

Mike: excellent post on the subject of slavery in America. I hope you can come to a place in your heart where the self-confessed "guilt" will be resolved. I don't personally feel you need to have guilt over what your ancestors did or didn't do. I believe that the Civil War was the price paid for slavery- for the involvement in it- both North & South. Is your guilt then saying that the Civil War was not enough? That's a question you must answer for yourself. Although I don't have any slaveowners in my ancestry- as far as I know- it was an issue I struggled with in the past simply because I'm white. Thank you for sharing on this Forum!

[Rob Wick]

It's a strawman to say people are judged based on what happened 150 years ago. People are judged based on their actions today, and try as we might, our society still hasn't figured out the questions surrounding race which prompted the Civil War in the first place. That said, I certainly have my own opinions on the matter, but as freedom of speech includes the right not to speak, I'm exercising that right.

Best
Rob

[Gene C]

Silence can be misinterpreted, but it's never misquoted

[brtmchl]

Eva and Bill, Thank you. My feelings however were not true to the title. I really do not feel guilt, what happened in the past is simply in the past. Rather I was trying to point out that this was in MY past, but it is over now. Because the past is the past, I am not afraid to admit this fact from my ancestry. I will not worry what people may think of me, because this is not me. I am not a racist because my ancestors owned slaves nor do I automatically believe that THEY were. I do not feel as if my family owes something to make amends because my past ancesters did something that was protected by law in the early 19th century. I do not condone Slavery in any form, just as I know nobody here does. My 21 century morality doesn't understand the mentality of this era, but I will not cast judgement on those who lived then.
What I do not understand is Why? As Americans, this topic of guilt still plagues our political and social climate. Why is the discussion about Slavery still such a heated conversation? Why 150 years later, do we still get so emotionally connected, that discussions about Slavery always turns into a fight, usually ending with someone being called a rascist? Why do we paint historical figures with a black or white brush? ie. all Southerners are rascist because they owned slaves and only fought to keep Slavery intact. Why do we still see Southerners portrayed in Movies and TV as rascist? I remember a recent episode of SVU where a Paula Deen like character shoots a young black man( ala Trayvon Martin). Later in the episode while being fingerprinted she asks an officer, because of an accent, if she was from Georgia. The officer replies that she was and the Deen character says that they both know if they were "down home" she'd be getting a medal. There is also a scene where she refers to her kitchen crew as " field hands." Why do our politicians always revert to Slavery to stoke the fire of racism or for that matter Eva, Use Hitler and Fascism to subdue or destroy their competition? But the most disgusting is the BIG business that hate mongering and victim portrayal has created. From Politicians, hate groups such as the KKK and Black Panthers, and also community leaders portraying themselves as "Reverends" dedicated to justice and inequality, they seem to be doing just fine. It almost seems that we really do not want to heal even though we say we do.
I don't feel guilt. Maybe it's because I am not worried that someone will find out the dirty little secret in my families past. And while most don't feel guilt either, we are constantly reminded that we should.

[Gene C]

All this talk abou Guilt reminds me of a Chrismas Song - "Guilt for Christmas"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-TbpDdPKoas

[L Verge]

Mike, you and I are on the same page. My personal opinion is that those who continue to try and cause racial and class discord have a political agenda that includes more than the issue of equality - and it does not bode well for the U.S.

I also question why those who fuss the loudest about racism, injustice, etc. do the least to overcome the problems. The press screams in order to get profitable ratings, the politicians take to the bully pulpit to get elected, some in the general public complain about the situation -- but how many put themselves out in the field to overcome their perceived grievances? Why aren't they working to solve the problems?

Why don't they become teachers in order to help overcome ignorance? Why don't they work with church groups and community groups to mentor and to train? Why don't they move en mass into political arenas and come up with feasible agendas for change? In other words, stop putting the blame on others for societal problems and work to overcome those problems.

I taught in the 1960s and 70s when the State of Maryland desegregated their schools via forced busing. I continue to live and work in the same county as I did then (and where my family has lived for over 150 years). It happens to be the wealthiest, majority black county in the United States, and I credit that to many of its people making good use of civil rights in order to educate themselves as productive members of society.

Yes, we still have pockets of poverty in Prince George's County where various races and creeds live. However, walk the streets, and you will see that drop-outs, the drug culture, lack of stable homes, and other negative factors are what are hindering upward mobility. You have to know what to do with the rights that you are given.

[HerbS]

I don't have "White Guilt"!My 2 greatgrandfathers fought in the Civil War.One was a "POW" in a Confederate Prison and lived.However,my ancestors had "farmhands" on their farms in Western New York.What were "farmhands"? I do have "survivor's guilt" from Viet-Nam!-enough said!

[Christine]

Interesting discussion. The other day I was helping my daughter with her AP History assignment and was thrilled to read this speech by Booker T Washington:

http://historymatters.gmu.edu/d/39/

His words resonated deeply with me, and I wish they were required reading for every American - regardless of their color, race, or culture. I talked to my 16 year old, white, privileged daughter about how those words also apply to her as well as others of this 'entitled generation.'

"Our greatest danger is that in the great leap from slavery to freedom we may overlook the fact that the masses of us are to live by the productions of our hands, and fail to keep in mind that we shall prosper in proportion as we learn to dignify and glorify common labour, and put brains and skill into the common occupations of life; shall prosper in proportion as we learn to draw the line between the superficial and the substantial, the ornamental gewgaws of life and the useful. No race can prosper till it learns that there is as much dignity in tilling a field as in writing a poem. It is at the bottom of life we must begin, and not at the top. Nor should we permit our grievances to overshadow our opportunities. . . It is important and right that all privileges of the law be ours, but it is vastly more important that we be prepared for the exercise of these privileges."

[LincolnMan]

(01-30-2014 06:12 PM)HerbS Wrote:  I don't have "White Guilt"!My 2 greatgrandfathers fought in the Civil War.One was a "POW" in a Confederate Prison and lived.However,my ancestors had "farmhands" on their farms in Western New York.What were "farmhands"? I do have "survivor's guilt" from Viet-Nam!-enough said!

I second that one Herb!

[brtmchl]

Kate, I assure you this thread was not aimed at you, but in full disclosure was created because of a discussion that you were involved in. One that just got me thinking, and that is what discussions should do. I just wanted to open a discussion about the divisive topic of slavery that still haunts our society. How we use it politically and socially and as to whether we can't heal because we are not allowed too. The disclosure of my family was an attempt to show that I am not afraid of being targeted by people that use racial attacks often for personal reasons. The past is the past, and no corner of the world is immune from their own involvement.

I'm sorry if you thought this was an attack towards you. It wasn't. I just wanted to say I am done with political correctness, I am done being closed lipped on topics just because it may make people uncomfortable. I will speak my mind and as long as I have facts, a well thought out argument and respect for the person I am speaking to, then society should not have a problem. Especially when others raise the question but do not want to hear the response.
This is a topic that should be discussed.

[HerbS]

Kate,As a Teacher of History and a trained mediator for 35yrs,I can realize your frustration! You have been a important part of this forum for awhile.Please reconsider saying,"Goodbye".Beware-I never give up!