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Lincoln and Ann Rutledge
05-07-2014, 09:34 AM
Post: #55
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge
(07-18-2012 04:38 PM)Rob Wick Wrote:  Just curious as to what members here think of the Ann Rutledge story?

1. I think it's a nice story, but no real proof so I think it's spurious.
2. I think it likely happened the way it's been reported.
3. I'm not sure.
4. No one will ever know.

Best
Rob

Hi Rob! I'm chagrined that I didn't know about the existence of this discussion group until 3:00 this morning. I've been out of the loop, to say the least. It perhaps goes without saying that, as a newbie, I'm unfamiliar with navigation & usage here. But here goes. The Rutledge story in my opinion is an extraordinarily interesting example of different sets of knowledgeable scholars looking at the same, very small body of evidence and drawing from it vastly different conclusions. As you and others here likely know, the story had its origins in what many scholars think was Lincoln's first known mental breakdown, which occurred in New Salem from late August to early September of 1835. This enigmatic episode in Lincoln's life--generally considered one of only two involving mental incapacitation serious enough that contemporaries became very alarmed--occurred in the aftermath of Ann Rutledge's tragic death, probably of typhus, on August 25, 1835. Some but by no means all of Lincoln's New Salem-era friends concluded that Ann's death caused his distress. A number of informants, including Abe's close friend, William Greene, stated for the record (notably to William Herndon, but also, in Greene's case, to Ida Tarbell) that the extremity of Lincoln's mourning for Ann proved the existence of a passionate love affair. The story first reached a wide audience when Herndon delivered a lecture on it on February 16, 1866, in Springfield. He cannily had sent printed broadsides to newspaper editors in Chicago, New York, and elsewhere; telegraphy hastened the story's spread and almost immediate fame; the Ann Rutledge story, imbued with themes of doomed high romance and the previously mysterious melancholy of a recently martyred world figure, virtually overnight became an international sensation. At last, Lincoln's sadness had been explained. Few commentators publicly doubted Herndon's interpretation. Many however were scandalized that the deceased president's former law partner had taken the liberty to so dramatically unearth an old love story that--this was a huge sticking point--cast doubts on the depth of Lincoln's love for his widow, the still-living Mary Todd Lincoln. What a scandal this was. Mary was livid. Her friends (such as they were) were livid. Almost everybody else was profoundly shocked, and fascinated. From these dramatic headwaters the Rutledge story set sail on an amazing voyage through American historiography. The ship, so to speak, survived a storm or two in the early 20th century, but seemingly foundered with all hands in the late 1940s when the great Lincolnist James G. Randall published a scathing and, it seemed, definitive debunking. But! Like a ghostly galleon the story revived nearly fifty years later. It proceeded to make a triumphant world tour with many notable ports of call. Then it sank again, or at least appeared to, thanks in part to yours truly, me (JALA, Winter 2005 and Summer 2010). In answer to the above quiz, I accordingly vote for (1): "I think it's a nice story, but no real proof so I think it's spurious." I can provide more details to the interested. The Rutledge story all by itself is most interesting. The story of the story in my (not disinterested) opinion is even better.
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Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 07-18-2012, 04:38 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rogerm - 07-18-2012, 05:24 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 07-18-2012, 05:48 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 07-18-2012, 08:31 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - J. Beckert - 07-18-2012, 08:39 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 07-19-2012, 07:33 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 07-19-2012, 10:37 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-03-2017, 04:13 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-03-2017, 01:23 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rsmyth - 07-19-2012, 07:52 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Joe Di Cola - 07-19-2012, 09:01 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 07-19-2012, 10:43 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 07-19-2012, 11:10 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 07-19-2012, 12:15 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Joe Di Cola - 07-19-2012, 01:54 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 07-19-2012, 12:56 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 08-01-2012, 07:13 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 08-01-2012, 07:58 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 08-01-2012, 08:08 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 08-01-2012, 08:20 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 08-01-2012, 08:33 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 08-01-2012, 06:51 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 08-01-2012, 08:45 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 08-10-2012, 07:15 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 08-10-2012, 07:17 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 08-10-2012, 08:47 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 08-11-2012, 06:30 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - HerbS - 08-11-2012, 10:35 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 08-11-2012, 01:26 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 08-19-2012, 06:15 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 08-19-2012, 09:48 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 08-19-2012, 10:24 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 08-19-2012, 10:40 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - GARY POPOLO - 11-22-2012, 01:48 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 11-22-2012, 02:23 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 11-23-2012, 07:47 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 12-04-2012, 04:12 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 07-21-2013, 01:30 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 07-21-2013, 03:30 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 07-21-2013, 05:29 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Tom Emery - 07-22-2013, 09:15 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Tom Emery - 07-22-2013, 03:14 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Hess1865 - 04-19-2014, 04:17 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 04-19-2014, 01:48 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rsmyth - 04-23-2014, 06:32 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Lewis Gannett - 05-07-2014 09:34 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 05-07-2014, 10:46 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 05-22-2014, 04:15 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 05-23-2014, 04:03 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-21-2014, 07:10 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-21-2014, 07:57 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - HerbS - 05-24-2014, 08:55 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-24-2014, 01:16 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 05-24-2014, 06:40 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 05-25-2014, 06:30 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 05-25-2014, 04:18 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 05-28-2014, 08:38 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-25-2014, 12:28 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 05-29-2014, 09:07 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-28-2014, 01:23 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-28-2014, 03:57 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 05-28-2014, 04:16 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-29-2014, 03:12 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 05-30-2014, 09:04 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-30-2014, 10:47 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-30-2014, 11:51 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 05-30-2014, 03:23 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-01-2014, 12:02 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-01-2014, 03:26 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-26-2014, 09:40 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 05-31-2014, 03:28 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 05-31-2014, 06:55 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - BettyO - 05-31-2014, 09:47 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - BettyO - 05-31-2014, 10:14 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-01-2014, 01:58 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-01-2014, 02:56 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Joe Di Cola - 06-01-2014, 04:41 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Mike B. - 06-25-2014, 04:27 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Mike B. - 06-25-2014, 04:37 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 07-02-2014, 09:22 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Mike B. - 07-05-2014, 07:07 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-02-2014, 05:03 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-02-2014, 08:12 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-02-2014, 08:30 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Hess1865 - 06-16-2014, 06:18 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-16-2014, 06:26 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-17-2014, 04:51 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-19-2014, 06:25 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-17-2014, 11:13 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Hess1865 - 06-17-2014, 03:25 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-18-2014, 06:12 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-19-2014, 12:51 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-19-2014, 02:24 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-24-2014, 08:17 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-24-2014, 03:49 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-28-2014, 09:11 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-29-2014, 07:34 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Mike B. - 07-07-2014, 03:14 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-24-2014, 02:31 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-24-2014, 05:26 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-24-2014, 05:46 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-25-2014, 04:16 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-24-2014, 10:33 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-24-2014, 11:06 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-25-2014, 06:23 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-25-2014, 10:40 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Rob Wick - 06-25-2014, 06:51 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Mike B. - 06-25-2014, 03:28 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-25-2014, 09:32 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-25-2014, 09:56 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-25-2014, 03:48 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-25-2014, 04:11 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-25-2014, 05:05 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-26-2014, 05:01 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-26-2014, 09:05 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Mike B. - 06-26-2014, 06:19 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Wild Bill - 06-26-2014, 07:54 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-26-2014, 08:27 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-26-2014, 10:06 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-26-2014, 12:02 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-27-2014, 04:24 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-27-2014, 07:32 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-27-2014, 12:53 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-27-2014, 07:55 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-27-2014, 12:57 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-27-2014, 02:16 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-28-2014, 11:53 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-30-2014, 04:11 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-30-2014, 09:37 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-30-2014, 06:49 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-30-2014, 08:58 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-30-2014, 11:22 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-30-2014, 04:02 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 07-02-2014, 07:55 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 07-02-2014, 09:20 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 07-07-2014, 06:51 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 09-02-2014, 06:52 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Angela - 09-03-2014, 01:34 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 09-03-2014, 02:09 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 09-03-2014, 02:27 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Houmes - 09-03-2014, 02:46 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 09-05-2014, 06:07 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 09-06-2014, 11:17 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 09-05-2014, 09:16 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 09-06-2014, 12:35 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 04-06-2016, 06:56 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - ELCore - 04-06-2016, 08:25 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 04-06-2016, 09:18 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 04-06-2016, 09:43 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 04-06-2016, 11:03 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 04-08-2016, 06:36 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Ed Steers - 04-22-2016, 03:38 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 04-25-2016, 03:40 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Joe Di Cola - 04-23-2016, 09:46 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - davg2000 - 04-24-2016, 08:40 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Joe Di Cola - 04-24-2016, 06:18 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 04-26-2016, 04:13 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 04-26-2016, 06:04 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 04-26-2016, 07:06 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 04-26-2016, 02:13 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 04-26-2016, 04:14 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 07-04-2016, 10:06 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 07-05-2016, 04:42 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 07-05-2016, 06:02 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 08-22-2016, 09:52 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Ed Steers - 12-04-2016, 07:17 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 12-04-2016, 09:51 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Joe Di Cola - 12-04-2016, 12:35 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 12-04-2016, 04:16 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 12-04-2016, 04:23 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Anita - 12-05-2016, 01:09 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Houmes - 12-05-2016, 01:45 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 12-05-2016, 01:39 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Joe Di Cola - 12-05-2016, 07:14 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Anita - 12-07-2016, 03:47 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-07-2017, 01:58 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-11-2017, 10:16 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-11-2017, 11:01 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 06-12-2017, 04:10 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - L Verge - 06-11-2017, 06:47 PM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - HerbS - 06-13-2017, 08:47 AM
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 06-13-2017, 12:15 PM

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