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The Unintended Irony
01-28-2014, 08:26 AM (This post was last modified: 01-28-2014 08:43 AM by LincolnMan.)
Post: #16
RE: The Unintended Irony
Herb- hope things are getting better and you are healing fast. As for Lincoln being a Christian- that has been a subject for debate from day one. Some believe he became a Christian (although later in his life)- others contend that he was athiest- while others argue that he was neither- that he believed in a "Providence." There are probably other views also on what he may have believed. I don't think the matter will ever be settled, but it's a subject that inspires lots of speculation in the world of all things Lincoln.

Not a bad way to spend a Sunday morning really.

Bill Nash
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01-28-2014, 10:02 AM
Post: #17
RE: The Unintended Irony
I posted something about the Lincolns' church in D.C. (New York Avenue Presbyterian Church) elsewhere on this forum yesterday. We know that Dr. Phineas Gurley was the minister there who developed a close relationship with Mr. Lincoln. While searching for information on the church, I found this quote from Dr. Gurley in reference to the President's religious persuasion:

"I have had frequent and intimate conversations with him on the Subject of the Bible and the Christian religion, when he could have had no motive to deceive me, and I considered him sound not only on the truth of the Christian religion but on all its fundamental doctrines and teachings. And more than that, in the latter days of his chastened and weary life, after the death of his son Willie, and his visit to the battlefield of Gettysburg, he said, with tears in his eyes, that he had lost confidence in everything but God, and that he now believed his heart was changed, and that he loved the Savior, and, if he was not deceived in himself, it was his intention soon to make a profession of religion."
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01-28-2014, 10:06 AM
Post: #18
RE: The Unintended Irony
Thank you for posting the quote Laurie. It's very compelling- and I beleive the strongest support for Lincoln having become a Christian.

Bill Nash
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01-28-2014, 02:54 PM
Post: #19
RE: The Unintended Irony
I think, the fact that Booth did not consider that serves as a reminder of his state of mind. He was probably full of rage and hatred and did not see clearly a connection between his deed and the date.
As for the question what his reaction was to the sermons published - do we know what newspapers he actually had access to? I have a publication that lists all the articles printed during that time and I find a lot of comments on the church services, but they are usually "northern" newspapers. Would it have been the same in the south? Maybe he never knew?
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01-28-2014, 03:23 PM
Post: #20
RE: The Unintended Irony
Since the stagecoach came to Southern Maryland every other day on its run out of D.C., mail and newspapers were delivered fairly regularly -- and they would likely have been the leading newspapers of the day, such as the National Intelligencer and the Evening Star. I suspect that Mr. Booth got wind of the sermons being preached.

I have often wondered what Rev. Lemuel Wilmer of St. Paul's Piney Church in Charles County had to say in his Easter sermon. Booth had used Wilmer's name at Mudd's (or at least Mudd said he did). The Reverend was one of the strongest Union supporters in Southern Maryland. Stanton had even designated him a chaplain in the Union army. If he preached on Lincoln and the Christ on Easter Sunday, Booth was not that far away.

Remember also the historical significance of the period around the 15th of each month. The days were known as the Ides. You are on your own to figure out the Roman and Julian Calendars, but it was all based around lunar cycles (I think, 'cause I got confused in school with these things!). The Ides were when taxes were due - giving to Caesar. Julius Caesar was also assassinated on the Ides of March in 44 BC.

Now relate this to Booth, and let me suggest that Booth knew exactly what he was doing in both March and April of 1865. He was raised on Shakespeare and Julius Caesar and was apparently very good at melding both into his political thoughts. If he indeed planned a kidnap scheme, it would have occurred at the time of the Ides of March (March 17, 1865). Every month had its Ides, so he was still on the Caesar route when he struck during the Ides of April. And who was Caesar in Booth's mind? Abraham Lincoln, to Booth the man who was destroying his country - just as the Roman senators had judged Julius Caesar.
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01-28-2014, 04:22 PM
Post: #21
RE: The Unintended Irony
Laurie: points well taken about Booth and his thinking pointed to Shakespeare- but for precisely that reason I don't think he was considering the Christian angle.

Bill Nash
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01-28-2014, 05:49 PM
Post: #22
RE: The Unintended Irony
Wasn't Caesar anti-Christian? If Lincoln's thoughts on Christianity were obscure to people of his time, Booth may have associated him as anti-religious also. Remember that Booth was raised to respect all religions.
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01-28-2014, 06:03 PM
Post: #23
RE: The Unintended Irony
Julius lived before Jesus.

So when is this "Old Enough To Know Better" supposed to kick in?
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01-28-2014, 06:05 PM
Post: #24
RE: The Unintended Irony
Oh yeah, ooops.
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01-28-2014, 07:23 PM
Post: #25
RE: The Unintended Irony
Actually Laurie is somewhat correct. The first Roman Emperor Augustus, who was Julius Caesars prodigy went by the title of "Caesar" as did most of the Emperors who followed him. Most of them including the infamous Nero were suppose to have been anti-Christian up until Constantine in the 3rd century.

Craig
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02-22-2014, 09:26 AM
Post: #26
RE: The Unintended Irony
Maybe Booth just didn't care that much about it being Good Friday. Surely, he was aware it was Good Friday. During the course of the day he must have heard about church services being held, people being let out of work to attend services, and talk among people about the entire Easter weekend. But like we all seem to think- Booth's overriding aim was to get the deed done- and the opportunity to strike the blow at Ford's that evening was a "gift" that he could not nor would not let pass. After all, back when he was merely planning to kidnap Lincoln- Ford's was already in the plan- so he had conceptualized the event to a large degree beforehand. Still, did he ponder, perhaps, that the death and resurrection theme of that weekend coinsided with the "death of the south" as he knew it- and it's resurrection ( to be caused by killing Lincoln).

Bill Nash
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02-22-2014, 12:28 PM
Post: #27
RE: The Unintended Irony
That is an excellent point, Bill, and I agree that Booth was not going to let such an opportunity pass. Besides, from a religious (and societal) standpoint, Lincoln should not have been attending the theater on such a holy day either. Maybe Booth thought that that day was predestined to bring down the tyrant.
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