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+--- Thread: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge (/thread-88.html)
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 04-25-2016 04:40 PM
(04-22-2016 04:38 PM)Ed Steers Wrote: I would love to weigh in on this, but it looks like I am way behind in the discussion. The article Joe Di Cola mentions is John Y. Simon, "Abraham Lincoln and Ann Rutledge," Journal of the Abraham Lincoln Association, vol. 11, 1990, pp. 13-33. If you do a timeline plotting when Ann and Lincoln were physically together in New Salem you may be surprised. To the best of my knowlege no one has bothered to track the two between Lincoln's arrival in July 1831 and Ann's death in August 1835.
By the way, I forgot to mention that I believe Ann Rutledge is still buried in Old Concord, not Petersburg. I wrote a chapter on my take in "Lincoln Legends" (Chapter 4, page 51). I think the evidence supports Ann in Old Concord. Montgomery did not move her. He took an arm bone (Ulna) and a bucket of dirt to Petersburg. Several artifacts from the grave (Hair bow, button, piece of dress, hank of hair) were removed and preserved. They still exist.
Dr. Steers:
Obviously Ann's body must have decomposed leaving not much left as it were. But you are saying there could have been much more taken than there was. This sort of reminds me of what happened to Daniel Boone's corpse- moving it from Missouri to Kentucky. We might honestly say that Boone is buried in both locations.
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 04-26-2016 05:13 AM
Bill, Ed may want to add to this, but his thoughts on the "reburial" are on pp. 56-58 of his book entitled Lincoln Legends: Myths, Hoaxes, and Confabulations Associated with Our Greatest President:
Please go here (includes a photo):
https://books.google.com/books?id=4SOr4PUFETcC&pg=PT74&lpg=PT74&dq=%22according+to+Hollis's+statement%22&source=bl&ots=Z6hEvqooh6&sig=p-uy-wHY14kYYGn0NWI8jJ8yiOM&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjOlYPD-qvMAhWEOyYKHbkkArkQ6AEIHTAA#v=onepage&q=%22according%20to%20Hollis's%20statement%22&f=false
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 04-26-2016 07:04 AM
Thanks Roger. Yes, it would seem that very little of Ann's remains were moved. In effect, she is really still in Old Concord. It's too bad her resting place was disturbed at all.
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 04-26-2016 08:06 AM
(04-26-2016 07:04 AM)LincolnMan Wrote: It's too bad her resting place was disturbed at all.
Apparently James McGrady Rutledge was originally against this plan. He was Ann's cousin and the only Rutledge family member still living in the area in 1890. However, he was persuaded to change his mind and eventually gave permission.
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 04-26-2016 03:13 PM
Yes, I remember reading about that. Hopefully his intentions were good.
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 04-26-2016 05:14 PM
"The road to hell is paved with good intentions"
According to Fido this saying was thought to have originated with St. Bernard of Clairveaux
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Eva Elisabeth - 04-26-2016 07:13 PM
Probably he adopted the Temperance take on his dog...
[attachment=2250]
Here's wherein the brandy barrel myth origins:
http://m.mentalfloss.com/article.php?id=20908
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - William Berry - 07-04-2016 08:44 AM
(07-18-2012 05:38 PM)Rob Wick Wrote: Just curious as to what members here think of the Ann Rutledge story?
1. I think it's a nice story, but no real proof so I think it's spurious.
2. I think it likely happened the way it's been reported.
3. I'm not sure.
4. No one will ever know.
Best
Rob
My family was close to the Rutledge family IN FACT my 4th Grandfather Capt William Preston Berry brother James was married to a Rutledge http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=18472722
Old Concord Cemetery Ann's first resting place is also known as Berry Cemetery
A first cousin was Lincoln partner https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4yl_ocQ4EK9WFRlaHdmLWJjdVNLdGJNMFJuV3FTR0hpYVVj/view?usp=sharing
on the eve of Ann death Lincoln spent the nite at Rev John Berry home pacing the floor
(04-26-2016 07:04 AM)LincolnMan Wrote: Thanks Roger. Yes, it would seem that very little of Ann's remains were moved. In effect, she is really still in Old Concord. It's too bad her resting place was disturbed at all.
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - William Berry - 07-04-2016 10:05 AM
Mister Lincoln was some what known for a roaming eye for the ladies
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 07-04-2016 11:06 PM
He was?
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 07-05-2016 05:42 AM
There is an excellent article about Lincoln and women here.
There are several interesting reminiscences there. Here's just one:
"Women found him a useful guy to have boarding with them and a respectful one when they came to the stores where he clerked. “Lincoln’s respect for New Salem women was demonstrated by his reaction when Charlie Reavis cursed around women shoppers. Lincoln demanded that Reavis desist, saying he would not tolerate such language in his store when ladies were present,” wrote historian H. Donald Winkler. “When Reavis continued the vulgarity, Lincoln admonished him: ‘I have spoken to you a number of times about swearing in the presence of ladies, and you have not heeded. Now I am going to rub the lesson into you so that you will not forget again.’ Thereupon he seized Reavis by the arm and led him out of the store to the side of the street where there was a patch of smartweed. Throwing Reavis on his back and putting his foot on his chest, Lincoln grabbed a handful of the stinging weeds and rubbed Reavis’s face, mouth, and eyes with them until he yelled for mercy."
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - LincolnMan - 07-05-2016 07:02 AM
Roger: I have never read the story about Lincoln. How far from that we've come in today's world.
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - RJNorton - 08-22-2016 10:52 AM
"This week, we not only celebrate the birthday of author Edgar Lee Masters (Aug. 23, 1868) but also observe the untimely death of Ann Rutledge (Aug. 25, 1835), who figured in his best-known work."
http://blogs.loc.gov/loc/2016/08/rare-book-of-the-month-i-am-anne-rutledge/
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Ed Steers - 12-04-2016 08:17 AM
To those who believe Ann's remains were removed from Old Concord I suggest you read my chapter, "Ann Rutledge's Resting Place" in "Lincoln Legends." Sam Montgomery (the undertaker and part owner of Petersburg Cemetery) only removed an arm bone and a bucket of dirt. The rest of Ann remains in Old Concord. Montgomery only wanted people to think he reinterred her so he could sell burial lots in Petersburg. Ann still lies in Old Concord sans an arm bone.
RE: Lincoln and Ann Rutledge - Gene C - 12-04-2016 10:51 AM
Here is an old photo of Ann's resting place in Concord Cemetery.
It's changed so much since this photo was taken, I wonder if this was really taken at the Petersburg Cemetery instead.
(no date for the photo)
http://alplm-cdi.com/chroniclingillinois/items/show/29017
Here is a chapter from Ed's book "Lincoln Legends, Myth's, Hoax's Legends...", entitled Ann Rutledge's Resting Place. A very good book. which I highly recommend, we have discussed under the Books category
https://books.google.com/books?id=wYmvvEeuAi0C&pg=PA51&lpg=PA51&dq=ann+rutledge%27s+resting+place+ed+steers&source=bl&ots=C0s8n9FioP&sig=50w7bLafaK2XtsVPEbd9bU7A_Bg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjvpdq_49rQAhWC7iYKHbhrCh4Q6AEIJDAB#v=onepage&q=ann%20rutledge's%20resting%20place%20ed%20steers&f=false