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auction - mbgross - 04-04-2025 01:34 PM
interesting auction.
https://hindmanauctions.com/new-noteworthy/lincoln-s-legacy-may-21-auction-in-chicago-to-feature-over-140-items-from-the-extraordinary-life-of-america-s-16th-president
RE: auction - Gene C - 04-04-2025 04:18 PM
What a shame to see the Lincoln Presidential Foundation auction off these items.
Anyone know the reason?
Are they that hard up for $$$ ?
RE: auction - mbgross - 04-04-2025 05:45 PM
They have, what I would consider, to be a huge debt. The debt comes from their purchase of the Taper Collection which was perhaps the greatest Lincoln collection in private hands in the modern era. (One of the items purchased was the questionable hat that has taken up a lot of press recently.) The bill has come due, and they are trying to meet their obligations.
RE: auction - Dave Taylor - 04-04-2025 08:40 PM
I've been waiting for this to happen ever since the Taper collection was removed from the ALPLM back in 2022. It is sad to see 140 artifacts sold away to private buyers, but I can't blame the Foundation for trying to pay off its debt, especially since it no longer has a partner museum to house these objects.
As much as I love the ALPLM as a museum, its leadership is responsible for this. There were many chances to correct the ship and fix the relationship between the museum and the Foundation. But the museum leadership chose instead to cut off their own nose to spite their face, time and time again. These objects would all belong to the people of Illinois right now if it weren't for the idiotic bureaucracy of non-historians in patronage positions. There's a reason so many wonderful historians and archivists have left or been fired from the ALPLM. It breaks my heart.
If anyone wants to read the long story of how we got here, I wrote about the loss of the Taper collection here.
RE: auction - mbgross - 04-05-2025 05:09 PM
Thanks for sharing!
RE: auction - Rob Wick - 04-05-2025 11:52 PM
Just a brief recommendation that people click on Dave's link to the story and take the time to read it (the TL DR note was almost as long as the post
) It's sad that politics did this. Great job Dave!Best
Rob
RE: auction - RJNorton - 04-06-2025 04:03 AM
Does anyone know the provenance of the gloves? To my eyes they look quite bloody. I thought at least one person in the box said Lincoln's wound bled very little.
RE: auction - Steve - 04-06-2025 09:16 AM
(04-06-2025 04:03 AM)RJNorton Wrote: Does anyone know the provenance of the gloves? To my eyes they look quite bloody. I thought at least one person in the box said Lincoln's wound bled very little.
They were supposedly sold by Mary Lincoln to a Capt. Benjamin Richardson. I don't know if this provenance story has any documentation behind it. But I was able to find a June 1868 letter from Mary Lincoln to Richardson where she mentions giving him "some of the specialties promised" which might include the gloves. I'll paste a transcription of the whole letter at the end of this post. I was also able to find a mention of apparently the same gloves being on display in a New York church in 1929, where the gloves had been loaned out by Richardson's granddaughter.
With all that said, I am almost certain that these gloves did not belong to Abraham Lincoln. It was Dr Leale who reported there was no blood coming from Lincoln's wound until he removed the blockage while examining the President. There was also blood on the left shoulder of Lincoln's Great Coat from the initial shot. So I don't understand how it's possible that gloves in Lincoln's pockets could even get that much blood on them (even from Rathbone bleeding).
If the gloves provenance can be verified, the best explanation I can think of is that perhaps they belonged to one of the doctors who treated Lincoln. A doctor could've gotten Lincoln's blood on their gloves if they were rooting around their pocket. Or maybe holding them along with a bloody towel or something with some blood transferring onto the gloves. Lincoln's clothes were left in the room at Petersen House and Willie Clark sent the clothes to Robert Lincoln days afterward. Since Clark hadn't been there during the events of that night, if the gloves had been accidentally left in the room it would be a natural assumption on his part that they were Lincoln's and included them with Lincoln's clothes to be sent to Robert. Mary probably wouldn't think to question if they were her husband's if the bloody gloves were returned with the rest of clothes from that night.
Private
Clifton House
Chicago June 15 [1868?]
Captain Benjamin Richardson
My dear sir:
Professor and Mrs. Sawyer, have just paid me a call and handed me your letter, which I am very much gratified to receive. I hasten to reply to it, fearing you may think, I have been negligent regarding my promises. And yet I am sure, you will be tantalized to know, that some of the specialties promised have been in my room & only awaiting their being sent to Mr. Sawyer. Tomorrow, my little Taddie will carry them down to the University and it may be the rest I will bring on to you myself.
After this explanation of the delay, you will feel relieved. My health still continues very delicate & each week I am hoping, my affairs can be arranged, so that I can get off to Europe. Alas! Alas! Unhappily some of us have fallen upon evil times and all that is left, is to endure patiently and resignedly the sad decrees of fate. It is very hard for me to combat with fate, after having for so many years the most devoted & indulgent husband. It appears that my immediate departure must depend upon the disposal of a small piece of property, out of which my expenses must be defrayed abroad, as well as dear little Taddies.
Feeling the need of a change of air, and indeed of everything to restore me to health you can well imagine, how restless I am feeling, awaiting the movements of a slow & I sometimes fear an indifferent agent. I should be now abroad, if these circumstances did not exist. And the summer is passing away so rapidly and each day finds me sadder in mind & weaker in body. Taddie & myself frequently speak of you and remember you so pleasantly. We have promised Professor Sawyer to visit the University very soon & what a great pleasure it would be to have you with us. If the dark clouds disappeared & I can soon arrange my troubled business, I shall soon have the pleasure of seeing you en route to Europe. Hoping you will excuse my frank and long letter, I remain with great respect
Very truly yours
Mary Lincoln
Article where the letter was originally published:
https://quod.lib.umich.edu/j/jala/2629860.0017.203/--unpublished-mary-todd-lincoln?rgn=main;view=fulltext
(Note, I corrected the bracketed year guess from the error in the original article; Mary and Tad left for Europe in 1868, not 1865. Also the article says the original letter was in the Taper collection, so it should probably be authenticated as well.)
RE: auction - RJNorton - 04-06-2025 11:48 AM
Thank you, Steve!
RE: auction - mbgross - 04-06-2025 11:51 AM
Good stuff! Excellent point about the letter needing to be authenticated. Even if the letter, was, I don't think it gives the gloves much provenance. I know that MTL tried to sell her dresses, and she gave many of Lincoln's items away to family and friends. But did she ever give away (or even worse, sell) anything related to the assassination? Anything as morbid as bloodied gloves? Would she have handled such a thing? Or sending "my little Taddie" with such items? Maybe it was in a box, and she didn't realize what was in it? As you can see, I am confused and have more questions than answers.
RE: auction - ReignetteC - 04-08-2025 12:06 PM
"But did she ever give away (or even worse, sell) anything related to the assassination? Anything as morbid as bloodied gloves? Would she have handled such a thing? Or sending "my little Taddie" with such items? Maybe it was in a box, and she didn't realize what was in it? As you can see, I am confused and have more questions than answers."
1. Charles Forbes claimed that Mrs. Lincoln gave (or shunned) the black suit her husband wore that fateful evening.
See his Affidavit (September 17, 1892):
"...Shortly after his death, when Mrs. Lincoln was packing her things preparatory to vacating the White House, she gave me the full suit of clothes which the president wore the night of his assassination... I asked her, 'What shall I do with them?' She said, 'Do anything you like with them. Don't let me see them again."
2. The suit's frock coat ended up with Thomas Pendel. Yet he claimed that Tad Lincoln gave it to him.
See his Affidavit (January 14, 1878):
"I certify that on or about the 222nd of April 1865, Tad Lincoln, the son of the President, presented me with the frock coat worn by the President when he was assassinated in Ford's Theatre..."
3. Then there are the heirs of Alphonso Donn who, for more than seventy years, claimed that Mrs. Lincoln gave him the bloody suit. He also held the president's greatcoat (overcoat). They produced several affidavits supporting their claim.
RE: auction - Steve - 04-09-2025 12:31 AM
Thanks Reignette! That Forbes affidavit really makes me doubt the authenticity of the bloody gloves story now!
RE: auction - Steve - 04-09-2025 03:54 AM
Reignette, what are your thoughts on the piece of Lincoln's coat taken by Dr. Ezra Abbott at Petersen House?:
https://www.nhhistory.org/object/160822/cloth-fragment
(Note: The NHHS is incorrect in it's description, Sarah M. Brown was Abbott's niece, not his daughter and Abbott was not the first physician to reach Lincoln - he was in Ford's Theatre, apparently in the Family Circle section, and didn't reach the box in time to be one of the physicians who treated him there.)
RE: auction - Dave Taylor - 04-09-2025 05:27 PM
Here's an article from 1925 about the gloves. It doesn't say anything in the article about the gloves being "blood stained."
https://digitalcollections.library.oakland.edu/files/original/1802b40a7007bf323ddeb6479a9d6da6f1a5f3ab.pdf
Also, these are not the only pair of Lincoln gloves attributed to Ford's Theatre. In 1956, the Illinois State Historical Library received a donation of gloves said to have been used by the President at Ford's. Here is the article from the Journal of the Illinois State Historical Society about the donation:
""LAST PAIR OF GLOVES A. LINCOLN WORE"
A pair of white kid gloves, identified as the "Last pair of
gloves A. Lincoln wore. Were found in his pocket after the
murder" recently were presented to the Illinois State His-
torical Library along with twelve letters by Mary Todd Lin-
coln, seven by her sister, Mrs. Ninian W. Edwards, and sixty-
six by Illinois Senator David J.Baker, Sr.
This collection constituted the major part of the Baker-
Edwards family papers and mementoes which were given to
the Library by Philip R. Baker of Pasadena, California. He
is a retired United States Navy Commander, a great-grand-
nephew of Abraham and Mary Todd Lincoln, and a great-
great-grandson of Ninian Edwards and also of Senator Baker.
The identification of the gloves is written in ink and
signed "E. L. Baker, Jr." on the back of his business card as
city editor of the Illinois State journal of Springfield. He was
Commander Baker's father and Mrs. Lincoln's favorite grand-
nephew- because he reminded her of her sons Willie and
Tad. The dozen letters by Mrs. Lincoln were addressed to
him as "Dear Lewis." The earliest of these was written in
Havre, France, on October 17, 1876 and the last in New York
on Grand Central Hotel stationery and dated March 21, 1882.
In this final letter she asked Lewis to take care of an invalid's
chair and some medicine she was sending. Soon afterward
Mrs. Lincoln returned to Springfield where she died the fol-
lowing July 16 at the home of her sister, Mrs. Edwards.
Letters by Mrs. Edwards are very rare and the seven in
this collection were written during March and April, 1862,
from the White House where she had gone to be with her
sister following the death of Willie Lincoln. Six of the letters
are addressed to her daughter, Julia Edwards Baker, and the
seventh is to Edward Lewis Baker, Sr., Julia's husband- grand-
parents of Commander Baker.
David J.Baker, Sr., was appointed to the United States
Senate by Governor Ninian Edwards following the death of
John McLean. His term lasted from November 12 to Decem-
ber 11, 1830 when the legislature elected John M. Robinson.
Baker left Kaskaskia on November 17 and arrived in Wash-
ington early in December. The winter of 1830-1831 was
famous as the season of the "Deep Snow" in Illinois but Baker
avoided it by staying in Washington until the following Feb-
ruary. The sixty-six letters by him in this collection were
written to his wife while he was away from Kaskaskia."
Here's a picture of these similar looking, but very much different gloves:
![[Image: lincolns-gloves.png]](https://lincolnconspirators.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/04/lincolns-gloves.png)
So, conceivably, while the ALPLM lost the Ford's Theatre gloves in the Taper collection, they should still have their own set of gloves from this donation in 1956.
RE: auction - ReignetteC - 04-11-2025 10:12 PM
(04-09-2025 03:54 AM)Steve Wrote: Reignette, what are your thoughts on the piece of Lincoln's coat taken by Dr. Ezra Abbott at Petersen House?:
https://www.nhhistory.org/object/160822/cloth-fragment
(Note: The NHHS is incorrect in it's description, Sarah M. Brown was Abbott's niece, not his daughter and Abbott was not the first physician to reach Lincoln - he was in Ford's Theatre, apparently in the Family Circle section, and didn't reach the box in time to be one of the physicians who treated him there.)
The description, "An attempt was made to re-move the coat by cutting away at the sleave to searching for wound until discovered in back of his head," fits Dr. Leale's account (of which he produced at least four).
It's definitely not from the black suit on display at Ford's Theatre and held as his assassination suit. It evinces no tears or damage. It is indeed a Lincoln garment as proven by three letters from Mrs. Lincoln. But is it his assassination suit?
The swatch of cloth and button could be from the frock coat in storage at the Chicago History Museum. Once considered an authentic Lincoln assassination relic until Paul Angle labeled it a phony. But is it?