+- Lincoln Discussion Symposium (https://rogerjnorton.com/LincolnDiscussionSymposium)
+-- Forum: Lincoln Discussion Symposium (/forum-1.html)
+--- Forum: Mary Lincoln and the Boys (/forum-4.html)
+--- Thread: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison (/thread-3446.html)
The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - jokash - 08-13-2017 06:25 PM
"The True Mary Lincoln" by Betty Ellison
Just came across this book and I was wondering if anyone has read it and what they thought. Based on reviews and excerpts, it appears to be a hagiography. Is it well written and researched? Does it add anything to the scholarship on Mrs. Lincoln? Thank you.
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - RJNorton - 08-14-2017 03:58 AM
Hi Don. Here is a short post Donna McCreary (an expert on Mary Lincoln) made about this book.
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - Susan Higginbotham - 08-14-2017 11:13 AM
I have it, but haven't read it straight through. I find the tone of the parts I've read to be off-putting; the author has a certain willingness to ascribe the worst motives to any contemporary of Mary whom she regards as inimical to Mary.
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - kerry - 08-14-2017 11:53 PM
In my opinion, it went too far in defending Mary at times, but I do find the tone understandable. It has some fresh perspectives on certain things that I found refreshing. With a lot of the patronage and corruption stories, other books don't really look hard into the other figures involved and the paperwork they left behind. Some of the intrigues Mary ended up involved in were minor, to-be-expected servant issues and creative accounting. That doesn't make them right, but I thought this book did a better job of explaining what exactly happened, instead of making it seem like Mary stood out as uniquely bad for smaller things everyone was doing. I thought she did a good job summarizing Mary's thought process at times, and did a more thorough investigation of the other parties involved - not to excoriate them, although at times the tone gets harsh, but just to give an honest view of the people struggling with these issues. There were definitely things I had not heard before in other biographies.
ETA: if there are factual inaccuracies, perhaps the new info is the problem...will have to reread.
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - RJNorton - 08-17-2017 11:34 AM
Speaking of Mary Lincoln biographies...in 100 Essential Lincoln Books (2003) author Mike Burkhimer writes the following regarding Jean Baker's book (1987):
"This is the best biography of Mary Todd Lincoln."
I am curious how folks feel. Jean Baker's book was written 30 years ago. Is it the best biography of Mary Lincoln ever written? Does anyone on the forum think there is a better one?
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - Susan Higginbotham - 08-17-2017 12:52 PM
(08-17-2017 11:34 AM)RJNorton Wrote: Speaking of Mary Lincoln biographies...in 100 Essential Lincoln Books (2003) author Mike Burkhimer writes the following regarding Jean Baker's book (1987):
"This is the best biography of Mary Todd Lincoln."
I am curious how folks feel. Jean Baker's book was written 30 years ago. Is it the best biography of Mary Lincoln ever written? Does anyone on the forum think there is a better one?
I think it is the best--but it needs to be supplemented with Catherine Clinton's biography, with Jennifer Fleischner's joint biography of Mary and Elizabeth Keckly, and with Jason Emerson's books about Mary. I think there's a need for a new scholarly biography of Mary.
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - Eva Elisabeth - 08-25-2017 09:42 AM
I would add W. A. Evans to the supplement list. While old I think it's still a good study and offers some valid points.
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - Donna McCreary - 09-12-2017 10:33 PM
At first glance, Jean Baker's book appears to be well researched and documented. It is neither. It is filled with mistakes, and sadly, since the book was first published in 1987, many other authors have used this book as source material.
Both the past and current curators of the Lincoln collection at the ALPLM and I contact one another regularly with mistakes we find in the documentation. The former curator of the Mary Todd Lincoln House in Lexington, Kentucky told me that she found over 100 mistakes in the first two chapters of the book. (I have personally only found about 60)
I own a paperback copy of this book which I read with highlighters. Things that are incorrect are highlighted with pink marker. Questionable information is marked with a yellow highlighter, and things that I know are correct are marked with a green highlighter.
Just a few examples (of the hundreds) of incorrect information include:
page 26: . . . "Ann Maria Todd, the unmarried sister now in charge of his Lexington household. (Her name was Maria Logan Todd and she was married)
page 30: Betsey pronounced her "a limb of Satan loping down the broad road leading to destruction." (this was only said by Mammy Sally.)
page 89: "Her sister Elizabeth, who bore the name of their mother." (Mary's mother's name was not Eliza - not Elizabeth)
page 184: "During her wait she had made Tad a Zouave doll . . . (the Zouave doll was a gift to the Lincoln boys)
page 237: ". . . and carried an ermine fan with silver spangles." (fans were not made of fur)
page 309: (regarding the Chicago fire) ". . . left behind a bundle of her husband's personal letters. Like most Chicagoans, she probably spent the night - and perhaps part of the next day - along Lake Michigan." (She would have traveled through the fire to get to the lake.)
There are also many problems with the footnotes. There are documents she claims to have used which do not exist. Quotes are misidentified as being on a page of a book. There are many, many problems.
Do I use Baker in my research?
Yes, but I verify information elsewhere before I state that it is truth, and I always check the source to ensure that it is correctly documented.
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - Gene C - 09-13-2017 06:15 AM
Wow!
Thanks Donna, I don't have Jean Baker's book, and I probably never will now.
I had thought it was "the book" on Mary Lincoln. It's coming off my wish list.
Like Eva, I have W A Evans book and enjoyed it.
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - Eva Elisabeth - 09-14-2017 07:13 AM
Not a bio but a very informative and well researched book (I l'd think, Donna may know better) is "The Mary Lincoln Enigma".
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - Donna McCreary - 09-14-2017 10:52 PM
(09-13-2017 06:15 AM)Gene C Wrote: Wow!
Thanks Donna, I don't have Jean Baker's book, and I probably never will now.
I had thought it was "the book" on Mary Lincoln. It's coming off my wish list.
Like Eva, I have W A Evans book and enjoyed it.
I also enjoy the W.A. Evans book. As I am trying to finish up my current project, the Evans book is sitting close at hand.
I will say one kind thing about the Baker book ---- there are many tidbits of information about normal Victorian life. Baker does know about women's history, and the information is good. Sadly, her purpose was to write about Mary as if she were a "normal" housewife. No First Lady is ever a "normal" housewife. (just my opinion)
(09-14-2017 07:13 AM)Eva Elisabeth Wrote: Not a bio but a very informative and well researched book (I l'd think, Donna may know better) is "The Mary Lincoln Enigma".
The Mary Lincoln Enigma: Historians on America's Most Controversial First Lady (2012) is well done. There are a few mistakes - one being in the Lexington chapter - the author indicated that Mary attended Transylvania University - and she did not. But, I have seen that written elsewhere, so the author was just repeating something others have mistakenly stated.
I always thought the idea of hearing different historical voices on one subject was a creative way of approaching a subject. I was honored to be part of the project.
Yes, I do recommend this book! It gives enough information about different aspects of Mary's life and several opinions about her character. In my chapter, I gave an excellent reason why she needed to have owned so many pairs of gloves. It is not an abnormal purchase; it was a purchase many women of a certain social position needed to make.
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - Eva Elisabeth - 09-15-2017 06:48 AM
And no one renders it abnormal when a female VIP nowadays possess some hundred pairs of shoes or handbags...
RE: The True Mary Lincoln by Betty Ellison - Gene C - 09-15-2017 10:20 AM
For some of these folks abnormal is normal
Any one remember Abby Normal from Young Frankenstein?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yH97lImrr0Q