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+--- Forum: Mary Lincoln and the Boys (/forum-4.html)
+--- Thread: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? (/thread-671.html)
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Tom Emery - 02-15-2013 10:26 AM
I don't think she ever changed her attire. If I'm not mistaken, one time Tad asked her if she would wear more normal clothes, since he didn't like seeing her in black all the time. Whether she complied or not, I can't remember.
Mourning practices were accentuated in society of that time, but Mary really carried it to extremes. I've always thought it was part of her personality -- she did things to excess.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - LincolnMan - 02-15-2013 01:06 PM
And I wonder what others thought of her wearing mourning attire for so long afterward? Did it add to the public perception that she was "crazy?"
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Linda Anderson - 02-15-2013 02:10 PM
(02-15-2013 01:06 PM)LincolnMan Wrote: And I wonder what others thought of her wearing mourning attire for so long afterward? Did it add to the public perception that she was "crazy?"
Queen Victoria wore mourning clothes after her husband Albert died in 1861 until her own death in 1901. The Queen wrote a lovely note to Mary after Lincoln died.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Laurie Verge - 02-15-2013 03:12 PM
Linda beat me to the punch. There was absolutely nothing that unusual about widows remaining in mourning or semi-mourning for the rest of their lives.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - LincolnMan - 02-15-2013 03:15 PM
Really? I had no idea! Thanks for the info on that.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Laurie Verge - 02-15-2013 03:23 PM
I think it depended on their age. If they were elderly and not in search of a replacement, they observed mourning. If younger and need of support from another husband, the widow's weeds came off after the prescribed time set by societal dictates.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Tom Emery - 02-15-2013 04:20 PM
Let me clarify my comment on Mary -- I was not saying she was alone in her mourning practice, and certainly was not criticizing her. I merely meant that her actions were carried to extremes.
I've always felt that her choice of mourning clothes for the rest of her life was indicative of the deepness of her mourning in general. She suffered greatly in the losses of her children and husband -- her life was never the same after those -- and her lifelong mourning attire reflected that.
I feel the same way on the connection between Queen Victoria and Mary Lincoln, and have been interested in the correspondence of the queen toward the former first lady.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - RJNorton - 02-15-2013 04:41 PM
Queen Victoria wrote:
******************************************
April 29, 1865
Dear Madam,
Though a Stranger to you I cannot remain silent when so terrible a calamity has fallen upon you & your Country & must personally express my deep & heartfelt sympathy with you under the shocking circumstances of your present dreadful misfortune —
No one can better appreciate than I can, who am myself utterly broken-hearted by the loss of my own beloved Husband, who was the Light of my Life, — my Stay — my all, — what your sufferings must be; and I earnestly pray that you may be supported by Him to whom Alone the sorely stricken can look for comfort, in this hour of heavy affliction.
With the renewed Expression of true sympathy, I remain,
dear Madam,
Your Sincere friend
Victoria Rg
![[Image: 5816083596_75b5f134d2_o.jpg]](http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2586/5816083596_75b5f134d2_o.jpg)
![[Image: 5816083420_2b5516fe04_o.jpg]](http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3261/5816083420_2b5516fe04_o.jpg)
LOC images
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Laurie Verge - 02-15-2013 04:58 PM
Note the black mourning band around the stationery - four years after Albert's death.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Jim Garrett - 02-15-2013 05:29 PM
I think it completely understandable for MTL to have remained in mourning for the rest of her life. For all intents and purposes, her life was over on April 14th. She was so completely identified with AL. She would have been nothing, if not for being the widow of the great emancipator. I believe when she met "incognito" with Elizabeth Keckley in New York City, she even had the veil.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - LincolnMan - 02-16-2013 08:59 AM
What kind of attire was she laid to rest in?
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Donna McCreary - 02-16-2013 11:55 AM
It was not abnormal, extreme, or crazy for a woman to remain in mourning attire for the rest of her life. When I study 19th century photos, I begin to think that most widows wore mourning for the rest of their lives. Photos of my own family members show many, many widows wearing not only mourning jewelry, but also the deepest mourning articles of clothing including black collars and under sleeves. Many historians comment that Queen Victoria set the standard for mourning customs. If this is so, then the 'standard' was to remain in mourning. Even Mary Lincoln's half-sister, Emilie Todd Helm, remained in mourning until her dying day in 1930. Plus, we must remember that a woman in mourning does not always mean a woman is a widow. Women were required to wear mourning for parents, siblings, aunts, uncles, cousins, children - and many women in the south wore mourning for 'the lost cause.' Many women, including Mary Lincoln, found themselves in a perpetual stage of mourning.
Did Mary ever come out of mourning? Yes, she did -- for one day. In 1871, Mary was at St. James Court. She wore a white silk gown trimmed in coral. Her jewelry was coral, but contained many mourning symbols - a wreath, cherubs, lilies. Why did she not wear mourning that day? It would have been inappropriate to out mourn Queen Victoria in her own palace. Now, this brings up an entire new question as to who was presiding at St. James that day. We know in one letter, Mary wrote that the Queen was not present. What we do not know is did Mary go back to St. James and see Queen Victoria? or did she only go the one time, and if so, who was there?
The story about Tad asking Mary not to wear mourning is mixed up. The story is that Tad requested Mary not to wear deep mourning on his 18th birthday. She granted his request and wore a lighter shade of black and something more in style with full mourning instead of deep mourning. In Gore Vidal's work, he had Mary granting Tad's wish by trotting out wearing something from 1861. In the movie, "The Last of Mrs. Lincoln," Mary utters some silly line about wearing the gown that she wore when she danced with Senator Douglas at the inauguration in 1861. She is costumed wearing an 1861 dress, but not the inaugural gown.
At her death, Mary was given a 'white funeral.' Her casket lining and her dress were made of white silk.
(02-11-2013 07:19 AM)LincolnMan Wrote: Maybe her faith was shook up with everything that happened. Maybe she was "mad" at God-and so the thought of going there was off the table. Just guessing...
Mary's letters are full of comments about her faith and God. In one letter written in April 1865 she wrote: “In my crushing sorrow, I have found myself doubting the goodness of the Almighty!”
Yet just one month latter when she expressed her doubts she wrote: “Yet I know, a great sin, is committed when we feel thus.”
From then on her, letters speak of God's will, His loving guidance, and her faith.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - L Verge - 02-16-2013 12:52 PM
Donna - could her white funeral have been a throw-back to her Southern upbringing? I know that some areas of the South (at least in later years) used white as a symbol of mourning during the summer months.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - RJNorton - 02-16-2013 01:53 PM
From Dr. Wayne Temple's outstanding book here is a sketch of Mary's funeral. The artist is unknown. Robert Lincoln is sitting in front of the casket and on his left is his aunt, Frances (Todd) Wallace.
![[Image: mtlfuneral.jpg]](http://rogerjnorton.com/mtlfuneral.jpg)
From the Abraham Lincoln Presidential Library
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Donna McCreary - 02-16-2013 06:12 PM
(02-16-2013 01:53 PM)RJNorton Wrote: From Dr. Wayne Temple's outstanding book here is a sketch of Mary's funeral. The artist is unknown. Robert Lincoln is sitting in front of the casket and on his left is his aunt, Frances (Todd) Wallace.
From the Abraham Lincoln Presidential Library
This little known engraving is also featured on page 151 in the outstanding book Fashionable First Lady: The Victorian Wardrobe of Mary Lincoln. Frances Wallace was wearing mourning for her husband.
Just saying . . . .
Laurie, I believe white funerals were an expression of mourning in many areas. Queen Victoria had a white funeral, so it may have been more common than we realize.