+- Lincoln Discussion Symposium (https://rogerjnorton.com/LincolnDiscussionSymposium)
+-- Forum: Lincoln Discussion Symposium (/forum-1.html)
+--- Forum: Trivia Questions - all things Lincoln (/forum-8.html)
+--- Thread: Who Said This? (/thread-2480.html)
RE: Who Said This? - RJNorton - 09-13-2018 07:22 AM
See if you can get this without googling.
I have a magazine from 2015 that has a quote about Lincoln. It was said by a person who knew him. I do not know the original source (if there is one) for the quote.
Who said this?
"There are many pictures of Lincoln; there is no portrait of him."
RE: Who Said This? - Warren - 09-13-2018 10:18 AM
Oh, I have read that and got to put the thinking cap on (foil of course). Won't cheat and google it. Nicolay comes to mind and it seems I read it in a book about Brady by Meserve's grandson.
RE: Who Said This? - RJNorton - 09-13-2018 11:24 AM
Excellent memory, Warren! You are correct. I was reading a 2015 National Geographic which contains an article entitled "Lincoln: Looking For His Legacy Today." And this quote by Nicolay is in the article. Quoting from the article:
"Nicolay described 'the long gamut of expression from grave to gay, and back again from the rollicking jollity of laughter to that serious, far-away look with prophetic intuitions beheld the awful panorama of war, and heard the cry of oppression and suffering.' Perhaps this is why Nicolay wrote: "There are many pictures of Lincoln; there is no portrait of him."
RE: Who Said This? - Warren - 09-13-2018 12:16 PM
Thanks, Roger - I edited my response because originally I thought Sandburg, but re-read the question and noted that it was said by someone who knew Lincoln. I had read the quote about 2 or 3 weeks ago, in the Brady book as I recall, so I defaulted to Nicolay as he was mentioned in the book. I'm sure everyone here has read it, but I keep reading over and over about how Meserve acquired his collection. Can anyone imagine what it would be like to acquire what essentially amounted to a warehouse full of glass negatives of almost every notable person of the mid-nineteenth century? And thank God for him, since the vast majority of them would have probably been thrown away.
RE: Who Said This? - RJNorton - 09-14-2018 09:19 AM
I was able to locate the source of the quote:
https://books.google.com/books?id=NnYAAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA933#v=onepage&q&f=false
RE: Who Said This? - David Lockmiller - 09-15-2018 08:11 AM
Did Lincoln really say the following?
In a New York Times Op-Ed,"The Secret to Cracking Trump’s Base," (Sept. 14, 2018), Timothy Egan wrote that Abraham Lincoln said: “No man has a good enough memory to be a successful liar."
I could not easily find an identifiable, reliable source for this alleged Lincoln quotation.
RE: Who Said This? - RJNorton - 09-15-2018 08:57 AM
I agree, David. I have seen that quote attributed to Lincoln on the Internet but never have found a legitimate original source for it.
RE: Who Said This? - David Lockmiller - 09-15-2018 09:31 AM
(09-15-2018 08:57 AM)RJNorton Wrote: I agree, David. I have seen that quote attributed to Lincoln on the Internet but never have found a legitimate original source for it.
Thanks, Roger. The comments section to this Op-Ed was already closed when I made my post to which you responded. Otherwise, I would make a comment to the effect that it is never a good idea to misquote Abraham Lincoln.
And, I just submitted the following proposed letter-to-the-editor of the New York Times:
In the New York Times Op-Ed,"The Secret to Cracking Trump’s Base," (Sept. 14, 2018), Timothy Egan wrote that Abraham Lincoln said: “No man has a good enough memory to be a successful liar."
I could not find an identifiable, reliable source for this alleged Lincoln quotation. It is never a good idea to misquote Abraham Lincoln.
RE: Who Said This? - Gene C - 09-15-2018 12:51 PM
(09-15-2018 09:31 AM)David Lockmiller Wrote: It is never a good idea to misquote Abraham Lincoln.
Can we quote you on that?
RE: Who Said This? - Eva Elisabeth - 09-15-2018 04:22 PM
And in the end, a misquotation is a lie, no?
It makes no sense to alter this image to make it Google-image-search-proof (quality suffers too much), so please be honest Abes and don't do it. I am fine with any other inspiration from Google on your part, just the simple one-click way is not the intention of this game.
The person and scene in this painting portrayed a quote on Abraham Lincoln.
Who is the person, where is he, and what is the "statement" of the quote (no need to quote literally)?
[attachment=2936]
(And an extra point for who uttered the quote!)
RE: Who Said This? - David Lockmiller - 09-15-2018 06:29 PM
(09-15-2018 12:51 PM)Gene C Wrote:(09-15-2018 09:31 AM)David Lockmiller Wrote: It is never a good idea to misquote Abraham Lincoln.
Can we quote you on that?
You can and you may!
(09-15-2018 04:22 PM)Eva Elisabeth Wrote: And in the end, a misquotation is a lie, no?
Not necessarily, a lie implies an intent to misquote.
RE: Who Said This? - Steve - 09-15-2018 07:05 PM
(09-15-2018 09:31 AM)David Lockmiller Wrote:(09-15-2018 08:57 AM)RJNorton Wrote: I agree, David. I have seen that quote attributed to Lincoln on the Internet but never have found a legitimate original source for it.
Thanks, Roger. The comments section to this Op-Ed was already closed when I made my post to which you responded. Otherwise, I would make a comment to the effect that it is never a good idea to misquote Abraham Lincoln.
And, I just submitted the following proposed letter-to-the-editor of the New York Times:
In the New York Times Op-Ed,"The Secret to Cracking Trump’s Base," (Sept. 14, 2018), Timothy Egan wrote that Abraham Lincoln said: “No man has a good enough memory to be a successful liar."
I could not find an identifiable, reliable source for this alleged Lincoln quotation. It is never a good idea to misquote Abraham Lincoln.
I traced some of the history of where the quote comes from. The earliest I could find it in a slightly different form is from a widespread 1907 print ad for the Ford Model K. The advertisement attributes the quote to Robert Ingersoll, but I don't know if that's true or not:
https://books.google.com/books?id=ytxDAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA132-IA31&lpg=PA132-IA31&dq=%22to+be+a+successful+liar+one+must+have+a+good+memory%22&source=bl&ots=hWmSXZKTpA&sig=W8JcLozWlq5gDz0cg77N1OArSog&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwixyP_tmL7dAhXyzVkKHW_bDpAQ6AEwAnoECAcQAQ#v=onepage&q=%22to%20be%20a%20successful%20liar%20one%20must%20have%20a%20good%20memory%22&f=false
In 1910, the quote appears in newspapers in a form closer to the present day version of the quote:
https://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/lccn/sn99021999/1910-10-30/ed-1/seq-12/#date1=1789&index=0&rows=20&searchType=advanced&language=&sequence=0&words=liar+make+memory+successful&proxdistance=5&date2=1927&ortext=&proxtext=&phrasetext=memory+to+make+a+successful+liar&andtext=&dateFilterType=yearRange&page=1
And the earliest attribution of the quote to Abraham Lincoln I could find was from February 1927 which is almost identical to the present version of the quote:
https://archive.org/stream/WinStar_010727_032527/WinStar_1927_1#page/n57/search/%22successful+liar%22
RE: Who Said This? - Eva Elisabeth - 09-16-2018 02:33 AM
(09-15-2018 06:29 PM)David Lockmiller Wrote:Oh, but the press are professionals who should check and know what they publish as a matter of responsibility. Especially such a prestigious paper should. (And then another German proverb says that ignorance doesn't protect from punishment, meaning it doesn't make the deed undone.)(09-15-2018 12:51 PM)Gene C Wrote:(09-15-2018 09:31 AM)David Lockmiller Wrote: It is never a good idea to misquote Abraham Lincoln.
Can we quote you on that?
You can and you may!
(09-15-2018 04:22 PM)Eva Elisabeth Wrote: And in the end, a misquotation is a lie, no?
Not necessarily, a lie implies an intent to misquote.
RE: Who Said This? - RJNorton - 09-16-2018 03:42 AM
(09-15-2018 04:22 PM)Eva Elisabeth Wrote: And in the end, a misquotation is a lie, no?
It makes no sense to alter this image to make it Google-image-search-proof (quality suffers too much), so please be honest Abes and don't do it. I am fine with any other inspiration from Google on your part, just the simple one-click way is not the intention of this game.
The person and scene in this painting portrait a quote on Abraham Lincoln.
Who is the person, where is he, and what is the "statement" of the quote (no need to quote literally)?
(And an extra point for who uttered the quote!)
Eva, can you give us a hint?
RE: Who Said This? - Eva Elisabeth - 09-16-2018 04:43 AM
I would prefer you first to try some y/n questions (on who/where that is, if real or...)