Post Reply 
The Spur Question
02-13-2018, 04:49 PM
Post: #76
RE: The Spur Question
(02-12-2018 07:47 PM)L Verge Wrote:  To me, such items need to be clearly labeled as to their provenance being in question .... so that the visitor does not walk away believing what is likely fake history.

Such as Booth breaking his leg onstage?
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-13-2018, 06:22 PM
Post: #77
RE: The Spur Question
(02-13-2018 04:49 PM)JMadonna Wrote:  
(02-12-2018 07:47 PM)L Verge Wrote:  To me, such items need to be clearly labeled as to their provenance being in question .... so that the visitor does not walk away believing what is likely fake history.

Such as Booth breaking his leg onstage?

Sarcasm noted, Jerry... As there is no definitive answer (i.e. proof) as to how Booth sustained his injury, I believe that the park rangers who give tours there now present both theories -- at least the last ones that I heard did so.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-13-2018, 09:21 PM (This post was last modified: 02-13-2018 09:30 PM by J. Beckert.)
Post: #78
RE: The Spur Question
I hurriedly tried to catch up on this thread and I don't know who asked about the damage the spur may have made to the stage, but I remember reading (Twenty Days?) that the carpet had a "rent" in it and the spur made a "semi-circular" dent in the wood. With the streets being the mess they were in those days, I'm sure the leather straps were constantly covered in dirt and mud, greatly stressing and drying out the leather. With the spur making a jolting landing as it did, with a hard blow on the wood, I can easily see the narrow strap snapping. I've seen car accidents with such force that well conditioned leather belts have split in two.

I've visited the Norm Gasbarro website that was referenced by someone. He's vehement critic of the Pike County flag, but it also seems he's got a lot of other axes to grind. He's made some very disparaging remarks about some well respected researchers. Some of whom are members here.

"There are few subjects that ignite more casual, uninformed bigotry and condescension from elites in this nation more than Dixie - Jonah Goldberg"
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-16-2018, 07:43 PM
Post: #79
RE: The Spur Question
I do not believe that description is in Twenty Days. Page 108 describes Booth's exit from the box and mentions several different accounts. There is no description of the carpet or the floor imprint. I do recall reading something very similar to what you describe. Hopefully one of our members can determine the source.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 04:50 AM
Post: #80
RE: The Spur Question
I am not sure if this will help, but there was a discussion of where Booth landed here.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 05:34 AM (This post was last modified: 02-17-2018 05:35 AM by AussieMick.)
Post: #81
RE: The Spur Question
There's this "These obstacles caused the assassin to lose his balance and he fell awkwardly on the stage, at least 11-1/2 feet below, tearing a rent in the green baize carpet." in

https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online_b...b/hh3e.htm


“In every child who is born, under no matter what circumstances, and no matter what parents, the potentiality of the human race is born again.” James Agee.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 07:10 AM (This post was last modified: 02-17-2018 07:13 AM by Gene C.)
Post: #82
RE: The Spur Question
Good find AussieMick.
Interesting sentence at the end of the third paragraph.

"Harry Hawk, seeing Booth striding toward him with a knife, ran through the center doorway on the stage and up a flight of stairs to the flies."

Flies ?

So when is this "Old Enough To Know Better" supposed to kick in?
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 07:25 AM
Post: #83
RE: The Spur Question
Another interesting sentence:

"In the fall, the large bone of his left leg was fractured about 2 inches above the ankle." This implies the wrong bone (tibia).
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 10:47 AM
Post: #84
RE: The Spur Question
The indentation in the wood was noted by W.J. Ferguson, who gave one of the most accurate and detailed accounts of the assassination.

"The next day I saw the semicircular indentation made by one of his spurs in the floor of the apron where he struck. Already I have noted the coincidence of his having been wounded previously at this very spot."

"There are few subjects that ignite more casual, uninformed bigotry and condescension from elites in this nation more than Dixie - Jonah Goldberg"
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 11:56 AM
Post: #85
RE: The Spur Question
To what is Ferguson referring when he says that JWB was "wounded previously at this very spot?" Am I forgetting about a stage fight at Ford's that injured Booth prior to April 14, 1865?
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 12:59 PM (This post was last modified: 02-17-2018 01:05 PM by L Verge.)
Post: #86
RE: The Spur Question
If you want a quick synopsis of what is in the museum at the Naval Academy in Annapolis, check out this link: https://thehistorytourist.com/2013/01/21...aling-wax/

I did note (with a museum curator's chuckle) the line of text that pretty much says that the museum accepts anything that comes from someone with a military background - provenance be damned!

I'm bored and will drive you crazy today!

This link from the Ford's Theatre site says that Booth's "boot and spur" were used as material evidence in the trial against Mudd: https://www.fords.org/lincolns-assassina...e-dr-mudd/ True? Was the spur actually introduced into evidence? If so, that would prove the Oldroyd spur story false as well as the Reams story, imo. Is the true spur another object of the crime that conveniently disappeared over the years?
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 01:30 PM
Post: #87
RE: The Spur Question
(02-17-2018 11:56 AM)L Verge Wrote:  To what is Ferguson referring when he says that JWB was "wounded previously at this very spot?" Am I forgetting about a stage fight at Ford's that injured Booth prior to April 14, 1865?

Could be describing a scene from The Apostate in which he acted with Booth.

BTW Ferguson always vehemently denied Booth said "Sic Semper Tyrannis". Another myth busted?
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 02:01 PM
Post: #88
RE: The Spur Question
Conger testified that he took a spur from Booth's remains. He was asked about it at the trial:

Q. [Exhibiting a spur.] Is that the spur?
A. I cannot swear that it is positively; I turned the spur over to Mr. Stanton; and, if that is the spur that has been in his department, its history can be easily traced.
Q. There was a spur?
A. There was a spur very similar to that: I judge that to be the one; but I cannot say so with certainty.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 02:27 PM
Post: #89
RE: The Spur Question
(02-17-2018 02:01 PM)RJNorton Wrote:  Conger testified that he took a spur from Booth's remains. He was asked about it at the trial:

Q. [Exhibiting a spur.] Is that the spur?
A. I cannot swear that it is positively; I turned the spur over to Mr. Stanton; and, if that is the spur that has been in his department, its history can be easily traced.
Q. There was a spur?
A. There was a spur very similar to that: I judge that to be the one; but I cannot say so with certainty.

So, no other mention of a spur being taken from the Mudd home? The one that Conger took from the remains would certainly seem legit, and since Booth wore a modified work boot when leaving Mudd's, it would seem that the spur would have remained with the boot left at Mudd's and later retrieved by authorities and then, year later, by Oldroyd. Still no explanation for the one left at Ford's other than to assume that, if it existed, it was the one turned over to the War Department first.

If we could just determine one legitimate spur with full provenance, it would be easy to throw out others that didn't match. As the King of Siam said in the musical, "Tis a puzzlement." And likely one that will never be solved.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
02-17-2018, 05:09 PM (This post was last modified: 02-17-2018 05:17 PM by AussieMick.)
Post: #90
RE: The Spur Question
As far as Booth shouting " Sic Semper Tyrannis" is concerned I saw (I'll try to locate link) a newspaper where an Irish audience claims he heard " I'm sick send for McMannis".

I don't know if this link (I found it when looking for my Tyrannis/McNannis quote) has been covered re. the spur.

https://archive.org/stream/assassinaxxx0...h/send+for


“In every child who is born, under no matter what circumstances, and no matter what parents, the potentiality of the human race is born again.” James Agee.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Forum Jump:


User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)