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BettyO · 06-29-2014, 05:30 PM

Ist Regiment New Hampshire Cavalry....still checking -

NHjohn · 06-29-2014, 05:37 PM

(06-29-2014 05:30 PM)BettyO Wrote: Ist Regiment New Hampshire Cavalry....still checking -

1st NH Cavalry doesn't sound correct....not for an ordinance officer in the regular army. That unit wasn't formed until 1864. Before that the NH boys were part of the 1st New England Cavalry/1st Rhode Island Cavalry.

BettyO · (This post was last modified: 06-29-2014 05:38 PM by BettyO.)

Here's another - this is certainly him -

NHjohn · 06-29-2014, 05:49 PM

(06-29-2014 05:37 PM)BettyO Wrote: Here's another - this is certainly him -

BINGO. Regular army ordinance. Makes sense to be in-charge of an arsenal.

L Verge · 06-29-2014, 08:03 PM

http://digital-library.usma.edu/libmedia.../V1882.PDF

Check this out. There is a program from the annual West Point reunion in 1882 that commemorates Benton, since he died the year before in 1881. Key points: West Point class of 1842 (year ahead of Grant - same year as Longstreet); assigned to arsenal at Watervleit, NY; significant role in development of Springfield Rifles at the Armory in MA; 1861 sent to D.C. as primary assistant to the Chief of Ordnance Ripley.

1863 - assigned to the Washington Arsenal. Biography is in the Lebanon, New Hampshire, Historical Society. Died in 1881, in Springfield, Massachusetts. Buried at West Point.

Working directly under the Chief of Ordnance, would he have a band assigned to him? Wonder if he was among those who demonstrated rifles, etc. to Mr. Lincoln at the Arsenal during the war?

Eva Elisabeth · 06-29-2014, 08:33 PM

(06-28-2014 02:30 PM)BettyO Wrote: That the food vendors were recorded to me, proves that they were actually there - as "tasteless" as it may be....

Would not have been the first time in history that people were "tasteless" - panem et circenses was pretty much the same.

And in July 1861, civilian sightseers equipped with picnic baskets went to Centreville Heights to watch the battle of Bull Run.

London Times correspondent William Howard Russell reported: “On the hill beside me there was a crowd of civilians on horseback, and in all sorts of vehicles, with a few of the fairer, if not gentler sex .... The spectators were all excited, and a lady with an opera glass who was near me was quite beside herself when an unusually heavy discharge roused the current of her blood —‘That is splendid, Oh my! Is not that first rate?..."

"Entertaining Parade. Watching the Federal army advance seemed like the perfect Sunday afternoon diversion." (Frank Leslie: "The Soldier in Our Civil War".)

NHjohn · 06-30-2014, 01:10 AM

(06-29-2014 08:03 PM)L Verge Wrote: http://digital-library.usma.edu/libmedia.../V1882.PDF

Check this out. There is a program from the annual West Point reunion in 1882 that commemorates Benton, since he died the year before in 1881. Key points: West Point class of 1842 (year ahead of Grant - same year as Longstreet); assigned to arsenal at Watervleit, NY; significant role in development of Springfield Rifles at the Armory in MA; 1861 sent to D.C. as primary assistant to the Chief of Ordnance Ripley.

1863 - assigned to the Washington Arsenal. Biography is in the Lebanon, New Hampshire, Historical Society. Died in 1881, in Springfield, Massachusetts. Buried at West Point.

Working directly under the Chief of Ordnance, would he have a band assigned to him? Wonder if he was among those who demonstrated rifles, etc. to Mr. Lincoln at the Arsenal during the war?

The question is, whether the "Ordnance Bureau" in Washington, D.C. had its own band, and where was that band stationed? The article says Benton was assistant to the Chief of Ordinance and commanded the Arsenal. Sounds like two positions held at the same time. Then the article refers to the "National Arsenal," after the war. One would think that was in Washington, D.C., but it's Springfield, Mass., as in the Springfield rifled musket. I would probably guess "Ordnance Bureau" and "Department" mean the same. As I wrote somewhere, I can say without reservation, the U.S. Treasury Department in Washington, D.C., had its own brass band. The U.S. Army Quartermaster Department in DC had it's own band, the Military Governor of Alexandria, Va, General Slough had his own band, the U.S. General Hospitals known as Finley, Carver, Harewood, Lincoln,Cambell and Armory Square had their own bands.(Armory Square was where the Air and Space Museum is now.) No reason not to think the Ordinance Bureau had a band. Just have to find it.

Eva Elisabeth · 10-13-2014, 08:38 AM

Another legal question -just theoretically, if a conspirator had been declared insane by experts and his acting a result of that (like in Major Rathbone's case), would law have provided/required lifelong commitment to an asylum instead of hanging?

BettyO · 10-13-2014, 08:54 AM

More than likely. Powell's attorney tried the insanity spiel but it didn't carry any weight because Powell was proven not to be insane. But likely, as in Rathbone's case, he would have been committed to an asylum instead of hanged.

Gene C · 10-13-2014, 09:51 AM

Garfield's assassination adds an interesting twist to your question. Guiteau was a bit insane, had previously been comitted but escaped (before Garfield's assassination), acted very peculiar at his trial, but the jury seemed to believe he was trying to avoid responability for his actions and convicted him anyway.

At his execution, he requested a band to play along while he recited a poem he had written. The request for the band was denied.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassinati...._Garfield

Eva Elisabeth · (This post was last modified: 10-13-2014 05:57 PM by Eva Elisabeth.)

Thanks, Betty, I read that about Powell and had him in mind first of all, but wasn't sure how likely this was to succeed - if the legal situation actually provided this.

Gene, thanks for the interesting info on Guiteau's last request!

LincolnToddFan · (This post was last modified: 10-16-2014 09:39 PM by LincolnToddFan.)

(10-13-2014 08:54 AM)BettyO Wrote: More than likely. Powell's attorney tried the insanity spiel but it didn't carry any weight because Powell was proven not to be insane. But likely, as in Rathbone's case, he would have been committed to an asylum instead of hanged.

Hi Betty,

That is one of the questions I had after finishing your absolutely first rate biography of Lewis a few weeks ago. I kept wondering how seriously his lawyer tried an insanity defense...especially after Lewis attempted to hurt himself by banging his head against the wall in his cell?

Do you think the Tribunal was so set on hanging him that they would not have considered such a defense?

But anyway, a Victorian insane asylum could be a fate worse than death...

BettyO · (This post was last modified: 10-17-2014 09:02 PM by BettyO.)

Quote:I kept wondering how seriously his lawyer tried an insanity defense...especially after Lewis attempted to hurt himself by banging his head against the wall in his cell?

Do you think the Tribunal was so set on hanging him that they would not have considered such a defense?

Thanks so very much for your kind words, Toia!

I think that Doster saw the only way to get Powell somewhat "off the hook" as it were would be an insanity plea. The fact that the boy had attempted suicide was a key note - and Doster used this to what he thought was as good a plea as any. Powell was said to not remember his mother's maiden name (Powell of course, his mother and father were 3rd cousins....but then Powell didn't want to reveal his parents' name nor did he want his parents to know what he had been up to.) Likewise, his constipation also played a part - his slow memory was more or less a result of the traumatic hooding. However, Doster found the insanity plea was his only recourse. Powell, it was said, was mortified when the plea was presented in court. I think that the tribunal was dead bent on hanging those who had a major influence on the Conspiracy - and with Booth dead, both Powell and Herold were the ones who were most guilty - Powell of assault on Seward and his family and Herold as the accomplice and "hanger on" of Booth.

Accordingly once source claimed that a commission member (I think it was Wallace) stated that "Well, Payne seems to want to die anyway."

So, no - I don't think that they would have considered a life sentence for either Powell or Herold. Atzerodt KNEW before the fact what was going to happen, but skipped out and did not alert authorities beforehand - so he was just as guilty.

LincolnToddFan · 10-19-2014, 01:25 AM

Thanks so much Betty, for your long and detailed reply. I am haunted most by your description of Lewis's family in the book, and the effect his participation and execution had on them. It breaks my heart. And they should have been allowed to bring their boy's remains home. What use was his corpse to Stanton, Johnson or the Gov't later?

And what became of the Branson women after he died? Let us all know when your new book is ready, please!

BettyO · 10-19-2014, 11:31 AM

Quote:And they should have been allowed to bring their boy's remains home. What use was his corpse to Stanton, Johnson or the Gov't later?

And what became of the Branson women after he died? Let us all know when your new book is ready, please!

I agree, Toia - all of the families should have been allowed to take home their deceased for closure at least. Whether Stanton or Johnson, the Victorians had a very strong feeling about death, the afterlife as well as how revenge should be handled. In a way, I can see that the "Powers that Be" (i.e. the Federal government) wanted to hang on to these deceased as a "show of retribution/revenge", etc. as it were. More or less, it was to be interpreted as a sort of closure for the nation - a "As they are so be you" if you attempt what they attempted.... so I can understand their direction - although I believe in affect, it very wrong - especially to innocent families who were also citizens.

As for those illusive Branson girls - I've dug up even more info on them, and yes, you will read/hear about these ladies further. There are also some surprises in store regarding Powell and Mary Branson.....

Thanks again for the interest!