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L Verge · 05-08-2014, 01:00 PM

"At 23 years of age, no one needs a guardian." Just to throw a small point in because I am very poor in the realm of Lincoln's background, However, I don't believe that it would be that unusual for a single woman of that age to have a guardian - especially if she had no male relative to support or protect her. God forbid that some jurisdictions (and society) would assume that a female could go it on their own if possible...

Vicky Reany Paulson · (This post was last modified: 06-23-2014 11:28 PM by Vicky Reany Paulson.)

The Indictment of Lucy Hanks is dated, April 26, 1790, so yes, Nancy Hanks Lincoln was born before this date. Lincoln was born in 1809, and Nancy Hanks Lincoln married in 1806, and was 23 years old. New DNA studies are confirming Nancy Hanks Lincoln is of the Joseph and Anne Lee Hanks line, by male descendants in the same family. The Berry family were high end furniture makers, where Thomas Lincoln worked, and lived nearby, with his brother. Richard Berry couldn't possibly sign her marriage license, because he died 4 years earlier. It was his son, that posted the required bond, and he signed that she was of age to marry. The bond was returned, when the marriage took place. Do you think his son was her guardian? At 23, there is no need of a guardian, period. Both Mr. Lea, Author of The Ancestry of Lincoln, and Rev. Louis Warren, her minister, proved the information of Caroline Hanks Hitchcock was totally incorrect.

(05-08-2014 10:28 AM)Ed Steers Wrote:
(05-08-2014 07:57 AM)L Verge Wrote: Ed Steers has done quite a bit of work on the Lincoln genealogy, I believe. Can we nudge him to chime in?

In as much as there are no references given for the many statements being made it is difficult to know where the information is coming from. Louis Warren is the man who spent a lifetime on this question. Paul Verdune followed up on the question concluding Nancy was born of Lucy in Tidewater, VA. I then followed Paul's work with research of my own and concluded that Nancy was born in Hampshire County, VA (now WV) near Mike's Run (New Creek). The weight of evidence in my opinion supports Warren's claim that Lucy was the widow of James Hanks and her father took her to Hampshire when she was several months pregnant. The fornication charge had nothing to do with Lucy and Nancy. It was filed long after Nancy was born and refrred to Lucy living with Henry Sparrow out of wedlock (as many on the frontier did). The two soon married and the charge was nulled. As to the Berrys, Richard Berry does sign as Nancy's guardian. That Nancy was raised by the Berrys is certainly true and not as an indentured servant or even as a servant. I wrote a lengthy article for the Lincoln Herald summarizing all of the data on both sides attempting to put everything in a single article. The preponderance of evidence supports Warren in my opinion. He was dismissed by most academics, unfortunately, without refuting any of his data. Before anyone makes a positive judgement on this matter it would be well to read the totality of evidence. My article is: "Nancy Hanks, West Virginian?" Lincoln Herald, vol. 100, no. 2 (Summer 1998), pp. 61-81. Ed Steers

The only James Hanks in the family was the son of William Hanks, not Joseph Hanks. James and his brother, Thomas are well documented. He has a wife, he is younger than Lucy Hanks, and his wife's name wasn't Lucy. Hitchcock used the records of a Hawks family, in Amelia County. If you check the records, no Hanks lived in Amelia County, in the time period she gives. I can even show you records from Macon County, Illinois, written by David Davis, the county clerk, who states Lucy's brother, William Hanks, who lived and died there, was the brother of Lucy Hanks, and that she was the mother of Nancy Hanks, Abraham Lincolns mother. I am so curious as to why there is not one document with any James Hanks on it, yet people argue to death about Lucy Hanks, who has documents, and the witnesses of at least 2 dozen people, that she was the mother of Nancy Hanks, including Lincoln himself! Hitchcock admitted she had NO documents to Lea, when he requested them.

(05-08-2014 10:28 AM)Ed Steers Wrote:
(05-08-2014 07:57 AM)L Verge Wrote: Ed Steers has done quite a bit of work on the Lincoln genealogy, I believe. Can we nudge him to chime in?

In as much as there are no references given for the many statements being made it is difficult to know where the information is coming from. Louis Warren is the man who spent a lifetime on this question. Paul Verdune followed up on the question concluding Nancy was born of Lucy in Tidewater, VA. I then followed Paul's work with research of my own and concluded that Nancy was born in Hampshire County, VA (now WV) near Mike's Run (New Creek). The weight of evidence in my opinion supports Warren's claim that Lucy was the widow of James Hanks and her father took her to Hampshire when she was several months pregnant. The fornication charge had nothing to do with Lucy and Nancy. It was filed long after Nancy was born and refrred to Lucy living with Henry Sparrow out of wedlock (as many on the frontier did). The two soon married and the charge was nulled. As to the Berrys, Richard Berry does sign as Nancy's guardian. That Nancy was raised by the Berrys is certainly true and not as an indentured servant or even as a servant. I wrote a lengthy article for the Lincoln Herald summarizing all of the data on both sides attempting to put everything in a single article. The preponderance of evidence supports Warren in my opinion. He was dismissed by most academics, unfortunately, without refuting any of his data. Before anyone makes a positive judgement on this matter it would be well to read the totality of evidence. My article is: "Nancy Hanks, West Virginian?" Lincoln Herald, vol. 100, no. 2 (Summer 1998), pp. 61-81. Ed Steers

Do you have your Authors straight? Rev. Louis A. Warren was the minister of the church in Hodgensville, and later in Elizabethtown. He had direct access to the records of Larue and Harden County. He was convinced Hitchcock was wrong, by these records, which proved the daughter of Joseph Hanks, and mother of Dennis Hanks, was Nancy Hanks that married Levi Hall. The Nancy Hanks, that married Thomas Lincoln, was the daughter of Lucy Hanks. I also looked up the wife of James Hanks, son of William Hanks, Joseph's brother. Her name was Nancy. He was quite active in buying property and had no orphans.

Gene C · 06-24-2014, 07:05 AM

Vicky, I kind of have gotten lost somewhere in all of this.
If I understand correctly, we are discussing who AL's grandfather on his mother's side might be. The grandmother's name is Lucy?

Who do you say was AL's grandfather on his mother's side (Nancy's father), and who or what is the documentation or evidence to support it, and where can the original documents or sources be found?

RJNorton · 06-24-2014, 09:09 AM

Vicky, I am like Gene and got lost. Do you have a theory on who Abraham Lincoln's maternal grandfather was?

STS Lincolnite · 06-24-2014, 06:29 PM

I have been reading this thread with interest as I have virtually no knowledge of Lincoln's maternal genealogy. I would like to read the article Ed Steers wrote to familiarize myself with the various points of view. Is this article available online or where might I find a copy?

RJNorton · 06-25-2014, 04:24 AM

(06-24-2014 06:29 PM)STS Lincolnite Wrote: I have been reading this thread with interest as I have virtually no knowledge of Lincoln's maternal genealogy. I would like to read the article Ed Steers wrote to familiarize myself with the various points of view. Is this article available online or where might I find a copy?

Scott, you can download a copy here.