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MaddieM · 06-19-2013, 07:00 AM

(06-18-2013 04:01 PM)Wesley Harris Wrote: I can't determine if the sound Fred heard -- "the click of the lock" -- was Powell cocking the pistol to prepare it to fire or actually pulling the trigger resulting in a misfire. It's essentially the same sound either way. Powell could have attempted to shoot him or he may have merely cocked the gun as a threat but then the fight was on.

That's interesting. But if he had cocked the gun and fired, surely there would be been two clicks.

Wesley Harris · 06-19-2013, 07:03 AM

(06-19-2013 07:00 AM)MaddieM Wrote:
(06-18-2013 04:01 PM)Wesley Harris Wrote: I can't determine if the sound Fred heard -- "the click of the lock" -- was Powell cocking the pistol to prepare it to fire or actually pulling the trigger resulting in a misfire. It's essentially the same sound either way. Powell could have attempted to shoot him or he may have merely cocked the gun as a threat but then the fight was on.

That's interesting. But if he had cocked the gun and fired, surely there would be been two clicks.

that's correct, Maddie. That's why I can't say for sure there's was a misfire which is the conventional assumption. We've all seen Westerns where the gunman cocks his gun menacingly to scare someone. That may be what Powell did. Or he could have pulled the trigger to shoot Frederick. We will never know.

MaddieM · (This post was last modified: 06-19-2013 07:07 AM by MaddieM.)

(06-19-2013 07:03 AM)Wesley Harris Wrote:
(06-19-2013 07:00 AM)MaddieM Wrote:
(06-18-2013 04:01 PM)Wesley Harris Wrote: I can't determine if the sound Fred heard -- "the click of the lock" -- was Powell cocking the pistol to prepare it to fire or actually pulling the trigger resulting in a misfire. It's essentially the same sound either way. Powell could have attempted to shoot him or he may have merely cocked the gun as a threat but then the fight was on.

That's interesting. But if he had cocked the gun and fired, surely there would be been two clicks.

that's correct, Maddie. That's why I can't say for sure there's was a misfire which is the conventional assumption. We've all seen Westerns where the gunman cocks his gun menacingly to scare someone. That may be what Powell did. Or he could have pulled the trigger to shoot Frederick. We will never know.

What's the amount of pressure on those guns? I don't know the correct terminology and don't know much about guns. Are they easy to *****? Easy to fire? Or do they require quite a bit of pulling? Would he have cocked the gun before he got into the building?

Edited to say... LOL there's a word filter on c.oc.k I can't say ***** the trigger!!

wsanto · (This post was last modified: 06-19-2013 08:38 AM by wsanto.)

Can you pull the trigger to fire this particular gun without cocking the device? We see it all the time in westerns-Clint Eastwood, opens his pancho, pulls his pistol and pulls the trigger multiple times: killiing five guys on a fence without cocking the gun for the first or subsequent shots. The action of pulling the trigger cocks the gun. Of course you could c.o.c.k. the gun then pull the trigger a little easier if you've got the time (say you only need to kill four guys sitting on a fence).

MaddieM · (This post was last modified: 06-19-2013 03:52 PM by MaddieM.)

(06-19-2013 08:30 AM)wsanto Wrote: Can you pull the trigger to fire this particular gun without cocking the device? We see it all the time in westerns-Clint Eastwood, opens his pancho, pulls his pistol and pulls the trigger multiple times: killiing five guys on a fence without cocking the gun for the first or subsequent shots. The action of pulling the trigger cocks the gun. Of course you could c.o.c.k. the gun then pull the trigger a little easier if you've got the time (say you only need to kill four guys sitting on a fence).

Don't they do that thingie with their hand like in the old westerns....for super duper fast gunslinger type firing? (yes, I'm hopeless about guns) Tongue

Didn't Powell have the wrong calibre bullets in his gun?

LincolnMan · 06-19-2013, 05:24 PM

No, the gun did not have to have the trigger cocked.

Wesley Harris · (This post was last modified: 06-19-2013 05:41 PM by Wesley Harris.)

(06-19-2013 08:30 AM)wsanto Wrote: Can you pull the trigger to fire this particular gun without cocking the device? We see it all the time in westerns-Clint Eastwood, opens his pancho, pulls his pistol and pulls the trigger multiple times: killiing five guys on a fence without cocking the gun for the first or subsequent shots. The action of pulling the trigger cocks the gun. Of course you could c.o.c.k. the gun then pull the trigger a little easier if you've got the time (say you only need to kill four guys sitting on a fence).

Powell's pistol is what is referred to as a "single-action" revolver. You must first coc.k it and then pull the trigger. With a "double-action" revolver, you can pull the trigger which both draws back (coc.ks) the hammer and then drops it on the cartridge.

(06-19-2013 03:42 PM)MaddieM Wrote:
(06-19-2013 08:30 AM)wsanto Wrote: Can you pull the trigger to fire this particular gun without cocking the device? We see it all the time in westerns-Clint Eastwood, opens his pancho, pulls his pistol and pulls the trigger multiple times: killiing five guys on a fence without cocking the gun for the first or subsequent shots. The action of pulling the trigger cocks the gun. Of course you could c.o.c.k. the gun then pull the trigger a little easier if you've got the time (say you only need to kill four guys sitting on a fence).

Don't they do that thingie with their hand like in the old westerns....for super duper fast gunslinger type firing? (yes, I'm hopeless about guns)

Didn't Powell have the wrong calibre bullets in his gun?

There was one newspaper report that said the lead balls in Powell's revolver were too small for the six chambers in the cylinder. Supposedly paper was stuffed in to hold the balls in. I'm skeptical of that because Powell had a .36 caliber revolver rather than the more common and larger .44 caliber pistols.

BettyO · 06-20-2013, 10:31 AM

I have that report as well as a silly one which states that Powell was also "armed with a slingshot!" The slingshot was reported found on him when arrested.....NOT!!

MaddieM · (This post was last modified: 06-21-2013 02:03 PM by MaddieM.)

(06-20-2013 10:31 AM)BettyO Wrote: I have that report as well as a silly one which states that Powell was also "armed with a slingshot!" The slingshot was reported found on him when arrested.....NOT!!

Sifting through the hyperbole and histrionics to find the truth must be a historian's nightmare.

(06-19-2013 05:37 PM)Wesley Harris Wrote:
(06-19-2013 08:30 AM)wsanto Wrote: Can you pull the trigger to fire this particular gun without cocking the device? We see it all the time in westerns-Clint Eastwood, opens his pancho, pulls his pistol and pulls the trigger multiple times: killiing five guys on a fence without cocking the gun for the first or subsequent shots. The action of pulling the trigger cocks the gun. Of course you could c.o.c.k. the gun then pull the trigger a little easier if you've got the time (say you only need to kill four guys sitting on a fence).

Powell's pistol is what is referred to as a "single-action" revolver. You must first coc.k it and then pull the trigger. With a "double-action" revolver, you can pull the trigger which both draws back (coc.ks) the hammer and then drops it on the cartridge.

(06-19-2013 03:42 PM)MaddieM Wrote:
(06-19-2013 08:30 AM)wsanto Wrote: Can you pull the trigger to fire this particular gun without cocking the device? We see it all the time in westerns-Clint Eastwood, opens his pancho, pulls his pistol and pulls the trigger multiple times: killiing five guys on a fence without cocking the gun for the first or subsequent shots. The action of pulling the trigger cocks the gun. Of course you could c.o.c.k. the gun then pull the trigger a little easier if you've got the time (say you only need to kill four guys sitting on a fence).

Don't they do that thingie with their hand like in the old westerns....for super duper fast gunslinger type firing? (yes, I'm hopeless about guns)

Didn't Powell have the wrong calibre bullets in his gun?
There was one newspaper report that said the lead balls in Powell's revolver were too small for the six chambers in the cylinder. Supposedly paper was stuffed in to hold the balls in. I'm skeptical of that because Powell had a .36 caliber revolver rather than the more common and larger .44 caliber pistols.

What difference would the larger .44 make? Regarding bullets that is?

LincolnMan · 06-21-2013, 02:04 PM

A slingshot? Murder! Murder!

Gene C · 06-21-2013, 02:36 PM

The .44 is a bigger bullet than the .36. All things being equal, it should make a bigger whole in what ever it hits causing more damage.

MaddieM · 06-21-2013, 04:04 PM

Where did the padded out bullet theory come from?

BettyO · (This post was last modified: 06-21-2013 06:30 PM by BettyO.)

(06-21-2013 02:04 PM)LincolnMan Wrote: A slingshot? Murder! Murder!

Bill, I can just see the headlines now:

"Secretary Seward and Son Shot with Sling Shot!"

"Assassin Thought to Be Dennis the Menace!" Big Grin

Seriously, Maddie - I LOVE it!! One never knows what one will find and a lot of times it is just plain silly stuff!

LincolnMan · 06-21-2013, 07:23 PM

That is sooo funny!!

SSlater · 06-21-2013, 10:53 PM

(06-19-2013 03:42 PM)MaddieM Wrote:
(06-19-2013 08:30 AM)wsanto Wrote: Can you pull the trigger to fire this particular gun without cocking the device? We see it all the time in westerns-Clint Eastwood, opens his pancho, pulls his pistol and pulls the trigger multiple times: killiing five guys on a fence without cocking the gun for the first or subsequent shots. The action of pulling the trigger cocks the gun. Of course you could c.o.c.k. the gun then pull the trigger a little easier if you've got the time (say you only need to kill four guys sitting on a fence).

Don't they do that thingie with their hand like in the old westerns....for super duper fast gunslinger type firing? (yes, I'm hopeless about guns)

Didn't Powell have the wrong calibre bullets in his gun?

That "Thingie" that they do in old westerns, to cause rapid fire from a single action pistol, is called "Fanning".