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+--- Thread: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? (/thread-671.html)
Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Rob Wick - 02-10-2013 02:40 PM
One of the trips Abraham Lincoln wanted to make after his presidency ended, as he told Mary, was one to the Holy Land. Yet in all her postwar travels, Mary never saw fit to go there. Why? To be honest, I don't know that there is any one answer to explain it, and my first thought was that given his mention of it, it would be too painful for her to make. However, he had also talked about visiting Europe, specifically Scotland, and she made those trips. I'm curious as to what might have kept her from doing so. Any thoughts?
Best
Rob
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Gene C - 02-10-2013 04:07 PM
Maybe she wasn't as interested in going as he was.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Rob Wick - 02-10-2013 04:56 PM
That is quite possible, Gene.
Best
Rob
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - LincolnMan - 02-11-2013 08:19 AM
Maybe her faith was shook up with everything that happened. Maybe she was "mad" at God-and so the thought of going there was off the table. Just guessing...
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Rob Wick - 02-11-2013 08:45 AM
Again, that sounds reasonable to me, Bill.
Best
Rob
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - antiquefinder - 02-11-2013 12:27 PM
Maybe Mary wanted to share that holy and special trip with just Lincoln.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Rob Wick - 02-11-2013 01:29 PM
Like I said before, I'm not sure there is one simple answer. The question just came to me after answering Roger's question on Scotland yesterday.
Best
Rob
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - RJNorton - 02-11-2013 02:02 PM
I second Rob. I did a search of her letters, and the only mention I could find of her mentioning this topic was in an 1866 letter to James Smith, former minister of Springfield's First Prebyterian Church. In her letter she mentions Abraham's wish to visit Palestine. During her two visits to Europe she wrote lots of letters to many people, but I could not find a single reference to the Holy Land. Rob's question is a good one, but I am not sure it can be answered as there is really nothing substantive to go on (at least none that I could find). Finding a simple answer may be impossible. Possibly Donna will see this thread - she may know something.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Tom Emery - 02-12-2013 08:16 PM
I'm with Rob -- those are some good observations.
It's also interesting to note that she continued a friendship with James Smith, the pastor from the First Presbyterian Church in Springfield, for much of her life, and certainly after Lincoln's death.
Of course, that does not automatically mean she would have been interested in visiting the Holy Land. But, as an earlier post said, was she questioning her faith?
Also, she may have been comfortable with Dr. Smith based on personal friendship and support alone, and not as a result of spiritual well-being. Dr. Smith was a staunch defender of hers, and spoke out against Herndon over Ann Rutledge (not arguing the existence of a romance, Rob -- just noting that Dr. Smith spoke out on Mary's behalf at the time).
Am I right in remembering that Lincoln and Mary discussed the Holy Land in their carriage ride on the afternoon of April 14, 1865?
In that carriage ride, they discussed their wish for future travel, and Mary certainly did enough of that on her own. But the Holy Land question is a good one to ponder -- thanks, Rob.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Jim Garrett - 02-14-2013 06:51 AM
The observation that the relationship between MTL and James Smith may not have been based on faith (at least on MTL's part) is a good one. Mary could have regarded Smith as a friend more than as confidant on faith. Smith, on the other hand, probably saw Mary as a friend who needed a friend and support.
Sounds like it was all AL's idea to visit the holy land. To travel there as the former president and first lady would have afforded much better accomodations than MTL would have received traveling alone or with Tad. I would imagine a trip to the holy land 150 years ago would be difficult at best, and uncomfortable with most likely primative amenities without the trappings that would have accompanied a head of state or former head of state.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - LincolnMan - 02-14-2013 08:14 AM
Maybe her health conditions prevented her from undertaking such a long faraway journey.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Jim Garrett - 02-14-2013 08:53 AM
It would have been an difficult journey under the very best of circumstances. If I remember correctly, her Atlantic crossings were very unpleasant. England is not even half way.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Hess1865 - 02-14-2013 10:36 AM
Maybe it was her real or imagined financial situation that held her back
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - Jim Garrett - 02-15-2013 07:30 AM
Could have been a very hot journey dressed head to toe in heavy black mourning attire.
RE: Why didn't Mary visit the Holy Land? - LincolnMan - 02-15-2013 08:04 AM
Jim, you're absolutely correct. She never did change from her mouning attire mode did she?