+- Lincoln Discussion Symposium (https://rogerjnorton.com/LincolnDiscussionSymposium)
+-- Forum: Lincoln Discussion Symposium (/forum-1.html)
+--- Forum: Assassination (/forum-5.html)
+--- Thread: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison (/thread-1624.html)
Pages: 1 2
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - Jim Garrett - 02-28-2020 06:16 PM
Rumor has it that the very secretive owner of the Booth mummy has found a new home for John Wilkes Booth, aka John St. Helen, aka David E. George.
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - Steve - 02-28-2020 08:24 PM
(02-28-2020 06:16 PM)Jim Garrett Wrote: Rumor has it that the very secretive owner of the Booth mummy has found a new home for John Wilkes Booth, aka John St. Helen, aka David E. George.
Hopefully, it's a nice respectable burial for poor Mr. George.
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - Jim Garrett - 02-28-2020 10:49 PM
The mummy is so full of arsenic, it's a mini toxic dump
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - Steve - 02-29-2020 02:51 AM
(02-28-2020 10:49 PM)Jim Garrett Wrote: The mummy is so full of arsenic, it's a mini toxic dump
A respectful cremation then?
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - M J Ray - 10-02-2020 09:06 AM
I am an author and local historian from Granbury, Texas. I am curious if anyone on here has ever had access to and read the 35 Affidavits from Granbury citizens who knew St.Helen, that were given to Federal investigators in the 1920's? They are part of the Swaim collection at Georgetown University, and there are also copies in the papers of Swaim's wife and daughter housed at San Angelo State University, in Texas. I am writing a book on local history of that time period (1870-1900)and would very much like to see in their own words how these people whose descendants I know perceived this man. I am unfortunately totally stymied on any kind of access to either collection because of COVID19. So it occurred to me that someone on here might have either contents notes, or actual copies that you would be willing to share. Thanks in advance for any responses.
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - Rob Wick - 10-02-2020 10:34 AM
Hi, and welcome to the forum.
I'm just curious as to whether or not you've contacted each facility to see if they are able to scan or copy the material you need? Given the limited staff that are on most campuses, I'm not sure that they are equipped to do this, but if you haven't then it's something you might explore. Also, since there are some students who have returned, maybe contact the history departments to see if they know of any students who would serve as a researcher for a fee. Hope this helps.
Best
Rob
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - Steve - 10-03-2020 02:51 AM
M.J.,
I would recommend you contact the Surratt House Museum in Clinton, Maryland as well as the institutions you mentioned. Their library has a lot of research material related to looking into the "Booth escaped" theory in their James O. Hall Research Center which might include stuff that isn't included in the other institutions:
https://www.surrattmuseum.org/
Unfortunately, the museum has been closed during the pandemic and I suspect the Research Center employees aren't available to make copies (for a charge per page) of documents like they had been before the pandemic.
I hope some of this useful.
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - wpbinzel - 10-12-2020 05:12 PM
(10-02-2020 09:06 AM)M J Ray Wrote: I am an author and local historian from Granbury, Texas. I am curious if anyone on here has ever had access to and read the 35 Affidavits from Granbury citizens who knew St.Helen, that were given to Federal investigators in the 1920's? They are part of the Swaim collection at Georgetown University, and there are also copies in the papers of Swaim's wife and daughter housed at San Angelo State University, in Texas. I am writing a book on local history of that time period (1870-1900)and would very much like to see in their own words how these people whose descendants I know perceived this man. I am unfortunately totally stymied on any kind of access to either collection because of COVID19. So it occurred to me that someone on here might have either contents notes, or actual copies that you would be willing to share. Thanks in advance for any responses.
M. J. - I extend my welcome to you as well.
I passed your inquiry along to Colleen Puterbaugh, the Collections Manager and Archivist at the James O. Research Center at the Surratt House Museum in Clinton, MD. This was Colleen's response:
Though the Surratt House Museum isn’t open to the public, the staff is still working per usual. At the James O. Hall Research Center, in the Hall files, there is an entire file drawer devoted to David E George/ St. Helen. I did locate the file that contains copies of some (all?) of the affidavits in the Swaim Collection. One note says they are from Box 10 in that collection. A full collection list is also included. That was in the 1990’s, now of course that is all online. You can find the contents listing for box 10 here- https://findingaids.library.georgetown.edu/repositories/15/archival_objects/1292476
See “Collection Organization” on the right hand side, you can click any of those to explore the collection more fully. The papers in general are here, for all the boxes therein. https://findingaids.library.georgetown.edu/repositories/15/resources/10551
Their main website does say that the Library will open effective August 26, and that many services remain available online. To put in a request for items in a box or probably to have one of their librarians do more research for you, there is a button to “request” at the top.
I say all this because, unfortunately, I cannot duplicate the materials to send to you. The restrictions from the Georgetown Library are very clearly printed on the materials. You will have to obtain duplicates directly from the records’ repository. If you could come to our site, they can be viewed in person. But of course, that is not possible due to distance or COVID restrictions. So hopefully if you reach out to the GU Special Collections again, this time they’ll be able to assist. Good luck!
Colleen Walter Puterbaugh
Collections Manager/ Archivist
James O. Hall Research Center
Surratt House Museum
9118 Brandywine Road, Clinton, MD 20735
Department of Parks and Recreation
The Maryland-National Capital Park & Planning Commission
history.pgparks.com
301.868.6185
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - M J Ray - 10-14-2020 09:42 PM
Thanks so much. I DID contact both Georgetown and San Angelo.
Georgetown access is closed due to Covid, but I am on a list to be notified when services become available.
San Angelo is closed and in storage due to construction of a new facility.- For another year.....
SiGH, But thanks so much for your info. I will check out that link to the index....
M. J. - I extend my welcome to you as well.
I passed your inquiry along to Colleen Puterbaugh, the Collections Manager and Archivist at the James O. Research Center at the Surratt House Museum in Clinton, MD. This was Colleen's response:
Though the Surratt House Museum isn’t open to the public, the staff is still working per usual. At the James O. Hall Research Center, in the Hall files, there is an entire file drawer devoted to David E George/ St. Helen. I did locate the file that contains copies of some (all?) of the affidavits in the Swaim Collection. One note says they are from Box 10 in that collection. A full collection list is also included. That was in the 1990’s, now of course that is all online. You can find the contents listing for box 10 here- https://findingaids.library.georgetown.edu/repositories/15/archival_objects/1292476
See “Collection Organization” on the right hand side, you can click any of those to explore the collection more fully. The papers in general are here, for all the boxes therein. https://findingaids.library.georgetown.edu/repositories/15/resources/10551
Their main website does say that the Library will open effective August 26, and that many services remain available online. To put in a request for items in a box or probably to have one of their librarians do more research for you, there is a button to “request” at the top.
I say all this because, unfortunately, I cannot duplicate the materials to send to you. The restrictions from the Georgetown Library are very clearly printed on the materials. You will have to obtain duplicates directly from the records’ repository. If you could come to our site, they can be viewed in person. But of course, that is not possible due to distance or COVID restrictions. So hopefully if you reach out to the GU Special Collections again, this time they’ll be able to assist. Good luck!
Colleen Walter Puterbaugh
Collections Manager/ Archivist
James O. Hall Research Center
Surratt House Museum
9118 Brandywine Road, Clinton, MD 20735
Department of Parks and Recreation
The Maryland-National Capital Park & Planning Commission
history.pgparks.com
301.868.6185
[/quote]
(04-18-2014 09:28 AM)Craig Hipkins Wrote: Wow, They do look quite similar! However, I believe Booth's hairline would have receded somewhat. Does anyone know how old St. Helen was when that photograph was taken? I believe that Francis Wilson included it in his book published in the 1920s. He probably got it from Bates, but I have never seen an original copy of Bates book so I am not sure if he included it in there or not.
Craig
I believe Bates mentions that St. Helen gave him the photo. If so, it had to be taken before 1876 which is when "Saint" left Granbury. So he would have been 10 years past the assassination give or take. Booth was born I think in 1838 so he would have been 37 or 38.
RE: Booth/St. Helens 1904 facial comparison - Jim Garrett - 12-30-2020 01:48 PM
The similarity reminds me of the unibomber trial. The defense attorney used as an exhibit, what appeared as the artist's sketch of the unibomber. The sketch showed the suspect wearing sunglasses and a hoodie. The defense attorney in several stages pealed back the sunglasses, hoodie, moustache, etc., and underneath was.....Lee Iaccoca!
The eye sees what it wants to see. If you think Booth and St. Helen were the same, they look alike. If you think they weren't the same, they don't look alike.