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+--- Thread: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" (/thread-165.html)
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - Linda Anderson - 10-20-2013 04:37 PM
No problem, Eva! Thanks for the link.
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - Linda Anderson - 10-20-2013 09:45 PM
I found this Letter to the Editor of the New York Press in the June 30, 1889 Macon Telegraph. "An Incident of History. Jame's R. O'Beirne Corrects a Statement Regarding Lincoln's Death."
O'Beirne. who was the Provost Marshall at the time of the assassination, "asks to correction of a statement which appears in your issue of to-day [June 23] to the effect that "Commissioner James Tanner took the dying statement of the martyred President, Abraham Lincoln.'"
O'Beirne goes on to say that Lincoln never made a dying statement unless he made it to Mrs. Lincoln "when she knelt at the bedside and bowed low to her husband's face."
Unfortunately, O'Beirne does not mention any ages or angel comment by Stanton but he does write that "When Mr. Lincoln breathed his last in a guttural, gasping struggle for breath, Mr. Stanton was looking out of the window into the breaking twilight of morning dawn, with one foot on a chair, and holding its back with his right hand, as he leaned with his left elbow on his bended knee."
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - L Verge - 10-21-2013 07:45 AM
Here we go again -- one source says Stanton has his head buried in the bed crying at the time of death and another says he is looking out the window. It's inconsistencies like this that can drive a researcher crazy.
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - BettyO - 10-21-2013 10:03 AM
Agreed, Laurie! One has to take into consideration which source was or seemingly could be the most reliable and weigh the evidence - something very difficult to do!
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - RJNorton - 10-21-2013 11:55 AM
(10-21-2013 07:45 AM)L Verge Wrote: Here we go again -- one source says Stanton has his head buried in the bed crying at the time of death and another says he is looking out the window. It's inconsistencies like this that can drive a researcher crazy.
(10-21-2013 10:03 AM)BettyO Wrote: Agreed, Laurie! One has to take into consideration which source was or seemingly could be the most reliable and weigh the evidence - something very difficult to do!
Is O'Beirne saying he was at the deathbed or is he simply writing what he read from other accounts? I have several lists of those present when Lincoln died, and none of them include O'Beirne. I think I may have once read that O'Beirne accompanied Johnson to the Petersen House, but Johnson stayed only a few minutes, and I assumed O'Beirne departed with him.
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - Linda Anderson - 10-21-2013 03:34 PM
O'Beirne is saying he was at the deathbed.
"I was officially present as provost marshal of the District of Columbia, with but short intervals of absence, too insignificant to be unaware to be of any important event to have transpired in the room where the great Lincoln lay on his deathbed from the time when he was first carried into the modest house where he died, on Tenth Street, nearly opposite Ford's Theater, now the Army Medical Museum. I was at or near Secretary of Stanton's side, under his orders most of the time, and stood near him at the rear door in the gray of the morning when Mr. Lincoln died. He had been unconscious, manifesting life only by heavy stertorous when he was first laid in the little bedchamber. When first brought there, he was [little] more than comatose, hardly breathing. At the suggestion of the physician a civilian then in charge of him ran to the restaurant next door to the theater and procured a large sarsaparilla glass of brandy, which was poured down Mr. Lincoln's throat and seemed to establish respiration."
Was there a window by the back door?
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - RJNorton - 10-21-2013 03:43 PM
Thanks. Hopefully Fred Hatch will see this and chime in. The most complete list I've ever seen of those present at the deathbed was in his latest issue of The Journal of the Lincoln Assassination. O'Beirne is not in the list.
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - Anita - 10-21-2013 05:01 PM
Linda, I found this on http://blogs.thetimes-tribune.com/pages/index.php/tag/general-james-r-obeirne/ There's also a photo of him here.
"After the war, General O’Beirne was the Provost Marshall of the District of Columbia on the night when President Lincoln was assassinated. According to his obituary that appeared in the New York Times on Feb 18, 1917, General O’Beirne took part in the pursuit of John Wilkes Booth and was in charge at the deathbed of President Lincoln. General O’Beirne served the federal government in several roles after the war working in the immigration service and as a U.S. Representative during the Boer War.
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - BettyO - 10-21-2013 06:25 PM
Wow! Thanks, Anita - facinating post!
More on O'Beirne: http://irishamericancivilwar.com/2012/10/28/james-rowan-obeirne-and-the-assassination-of-abraham-lincoln/
![[Image: 2ewa.jpg]](http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/545/2ewa.jpg/)
Provost Marshall O'Beirne at the of the Assassination
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - L Verge - 10-21-2013 06:31 PM
This account appears to have O'Beirne on the streets of D.C. while the President lay dying.
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - wsanto - 10-21-2013 06:38 PM
I tend to go with "ages"
It seems evident that many in these times were obsessed on some level with the idea of legacy. They had role models in Washington and Jefferson and the other Founding Fathers not far removed from them.
Legacy motivated them and directed their choices to volunteer to fight in wars and to run for political office.
It is clear that legacy was a commen over-riding thread that motivated men like Lincoln and Seward and Chase and Stanton and even Booth. They all wanted to make their mark on history and be remembered forever. Much like their heroes--the Founding Fathers.
It is no surprise to me that Stanton would validate Lincoln's unquestionable legacy at the time of his death with "now he belongs to the ages". Everyone in his audience probably longed for the same. The supremency of Lincoln's legacy was probably on the minds of everyone in the room and Stanton verbalized it beautifully and succinctly.
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - Hess1865 - 10-21-2013 08:04 PM
I go with 'ages' too
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - Linda Anderson - 10-21-2013 08:13 PM
Thanks, Anita and Betty. I found a New York Times article dated 12/7/1930, titled "A New Version of the Greatest Man Hunt: Major O'Beirne's Diary, Recently Brought to Light, Describes The Difficulties of the Chase After Lincoln's Assassination."
"Some heretofore unrecorded details of one of the greatest manhunts in American history are set forth in the Stanton order and other original documents which recently have come into the possession of John J. Madigan of 12 East 47 Street, New York."
O'Beirne had conducted Andrew Johnson "to the house opposite Ford's Theater, where the President lay unconscious and dying...As soon as the President was dead O'Beirne returned to the Kirkwood House."
Does anyone know where O'Beirne's diary is located now?
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - Anita - 10-21-2013 11:55 PM
Oh my, you'll never guess who had O'beirne's papers and diary- OTTO EISENSCHIML!!
Below is a footnote from his book "Why Was Lincoln Murdered?"
8 O'Beirne papers � A collection of documents left by Major
(later General) James Rowan O'Beirne, in possession of the author.
The papers also include a diary kept by O'Beirne
while the pursuit of Booth was in progress,and some letters of Captain Beckwith
http://tera-3.ul.cs.cmu.edu/NASD/d23d381a-642a-4cb1-bd42-5373f518ed1d/lemur/6748.sgml
Could Carnegie Mellon U be in possession of Otto Eisenschiml's papers?
RE: Your guess: "angels" or "ages?" - RJNorton - 10-22-2013 04:21 AM
(10-21-2013 06:31 PM)L Verge Wrote: This account appears to have O'Beirne on the streets of D.C. while the President lay dying.
Laurie, this is also what I have thought. The reason I am so interested in this topic is that I receive questions about the deathbed through my website, and for 17 years I have been giving out wrong information if O'Beirne were there.
I think my best source has been W. Emerson Reck's A. Lincoln: His Last 24 Hours." The only mention of O'Beirne is in conjunction with Johnson's very brief visit around 1:30 A.M. Reck has a very detailed account of the last few hours prior to the president's death, and he mentions many names being there, but absolutely no mention of O'Beirne.
In looking at the Rubber Room booklet by Harold Holzer and Frank Williams I cannot find a single mention of O'Beirne in any of various deathbed drawings. This includes Chappel's lithograph that includes an incredible 47 people (many of whom were really not there). O'Beirne is not one of the 47.
As I mentioned before Fred Hatch does not include O'Beirne in his list of people at the deathbed.
I would love to see a definitive answer to this so I can correct my files if need be. Was O'Beirne the type of person who would embellish things many years after the fact? I do not know, but I think I would at least like to see evidence that another mourner at the deathbed saw him there. As far as I can tell, that evidence is lacking. For example, Gideon Welles mentions people he saw there in his diary but O'Beirne is not listed.
If Jim Garrett sees this maybe he will know if Ford's Theatre keeps a list of those folks present at the deathbed.